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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
we have more 'classics oriented' posters (man I remember when I was a rarity) I must refresh the collective mind. Boonen very good, 2 R-V-V's, 1 GW, 1 P-R and a WC (so far)

Eddy (just the Spring races)
7 Milan San Remos (66,67,69,71,72,75and 76)
5 Liege Bastogne Liege (69,71, 72, 73, 75)
3 Paris Roubaix (68, 70, 73)
2 Ronde van Vlanderaan (69, 75)
2 Amstel (73,75)
3 Fleche Wallone (67, 70, 72)
3 Gent (Gand) Wevelgem ((67, 70, 73)
3 World Championships (67, 71, 74)
1 Amateur WC (64)

damn......
now add that in his first 2 GT's (68 Giro,69 Tour) he won all 3 jerseys (Leader, Points Leader and KoM)

double damn

and he's still one of the only racers to be competitive from MSR to L-B-L
 

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jesus.
so. damn. good.
 

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You could also...

atpjunkie said:
we have more 'classics oriented' posters (man I remember when I was a rarity) I must refresh the collective mind. Boonen very good, 2 R-V-V's, 1 GW, 1 P-R and a WC (so far)

Eddy (just the Spring races)
7 Milan San Remos (66,67,69,71,72,75and 76)
5 Liege Bastogne Liege (69,71, 72, 73, 75)
3 Paris Roubaix (68, 70, 73)
2 Ronde van Vlanderaan (69, 75)
2 Amstel (73,75)
3 Fleche Wallone (67, 70, 72)
3 Gent (Gand) Wevelgem ((67, 70, 73)
3 World Championships (67, 71, 74)
1 Amateur WC (64)

damn......
now add that in his first 2 GT's (68 Giro,69 Tour) he won all 3 jerseys (Leader, Points Leader and KoM)

double damn

and he's still one of the only racers to be competitive from MSR to L-B-L
You could also speak about other rides of his generation, who were also dominant in their own right. I mean, nobody will ever be as dominant as Merckx, that's just a fact. I was reading an article the other day about Rik Van Looy. In his best season ever, he won 43, count 'em, 43 professional bike races. And he never won less than 10 his entire career, and consider he rode during the time of Eddy, that's pretty darn respectable. Then there is De Vlaminick (I'm sure I just butchered his name)... And others. Could move onward to Sean Kelly, and so on and so forth.
 

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nice thread atp - interesting that the great names of Merckx's era are probably the most resonant of any cycling era - truly the golden age
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
thx B-Girl

everyone says 'well it'sdifferent now,people specialize" but the reality is back then there were more 'all rounders' so competition has always been kept kinda equal.
Eddy raced against legends, Poulidor, don't forget him, now Roger De Vlaemnic was more of a 1 day specialist so there were some back then as well (and Eddy still beat them).
So who else Gimondi, Ocana, Thevenet,Maertens,Moser,Sercu, etc....
He defeated some tough hombres.
lets not forget 2 Giro d Lombardia's either
3 paris Nice
1 Tour of Romandy
1 Dauphine
1Midi Libre

the hour record

17 six day races on the track
3 Euro Track Champioships'
7 Belgian madison Champioships (with Sercu)
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
so anyhow how does this look? how I kinda see it

1) Merckx
2) Coppi
3) Hinault
4) Bartali
5) Gimondi
6) Bobet
7) Anquetil
8 -10) 3 way Van Looy, Kelly,De Vlaeminck
 

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Bianchigirl said:
nice thread atp - interesting that the great names of Merckx's era are probably the most resonant of any cycling era - truly the golden age
Was it the golden era or is it just a question of nostalgia, interesting that the same timeframe is sometimes considered the golden era of Football as well: Cruijff, Pele, Best, Platini, Beckenbaeur.
 

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Cyclinghalloffame

atpjunkie said:
1) Merckx
2) Coppi
3) Hinault
4) Bartali
5) Gimondi
6) Bobet
7) Anquetil
8 -10) 3 way Van Looy, Kelly,De Vlaeminck
Cyclinghalloffame.com has its own proposed ranking system, and here's the top 10:

1. Eddy Merckx, BEL
2. Bernard Hinault, FRA
3. Fausto Coppi, ITA
4. Gino Bartali, ITA
5. Jacques Anquetil, FRA
6. Lance Armstrong, USA
7. Miguel Indurain, ESP
8. Felice Gimondi, ITA
9. Louison Bobet, FRA
10. Joop Zoetemelk, HOL
11. Greg Lemond, USA
12. Raymond Poulidor, FRA
13. Francesco Moser, ITA

De Vlaeminck is #25 in that ranking.

They give 1300 for winning le Tour, 600 for la Giro, 500 for la Vuelta. Monuments are up to 300, and the Worlds is worth 400.
 

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atpjunkie said:
1) Merckx
2) Coppi
3) Hinault
4) Bartali
5) Gimondi
6) Bobet
7) Anquetil
8 -10) 3 way Van Looy, Kelly,De Vlaeminck
Works pretty well for me - though maybe Hinault second just for being one tough, stubborn b'stard
 

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It's quicker to say the only thing Merckx didn't win was Paris Tours. Won almost a third of the races he entered and most of that was after the Derny crash that made "climbing no longer the waltz is once was" to paraphrase his words. The monster 1969 Tour before the crash really makes me wonder what he might have done if he felt good for a few more years.

I agree with Bernie at #2. Were it not for WWII Bartoli and Coppi would both likely have racked up quite a few more wins, but then you are on that slippery slope of whatifs.
 

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grasso e lento
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What about the Lion King

Mario Cipollini : As a sprinter, he won just about every race he possibly could, including a record 42 stages of the Giro d'Italia. He also won the Milan-San Remo and Gent-Wevelgem classics in the same year, and has an endless list of wins in stage-races like the Tirreno-Adriatico, Paris-Nice, Tour of Valencia, Tour de Romandie and Tour Mediterranean. He won a total of 12 Tour de France stages - including four in the same race, 1999. And he won three stages of the 2002 Vuelta a España as well. It was his win in the 2002 World Road Championships that set the seal on Cipollini's glittering career, although in hindsight, becoming World Champion was also the beginning of the end for Mario. His form was never the same again, at 36 years of age it was to be expected one supposes. Cipollini won two stages of the 2003 Giro - equaling then surpassing Alfredo Binda's record at the time
 

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Yeah, but Eddy never won Paris-Tours, so he'll <i>never</i> be a complete rider to me.

Even frickin' Richard Virenque won Paris-Tours!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
that is really funny

you make a comment about 'what if' Merckx hadn't the derny crash and then say you don't want to get into the what ifs. ;o)

Sorry but Fausto is #2 in my book because he achieved all he did and missed 4 years of his prime. plus all the a$$ kicking he did on the track.

Cippo a great sprinter, not a complete rider had Alpaphobia as well.

someone said Virenque amonst all these greatest, even in jest you should be shackled to a post and pelted with tomatoes.
 

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atpjunkie said:
everyone says 'well it'sdifferent now,people specialize" but the reality is back then there were more 'all rounders' so competition has always been kept kinda equal.
Eddy raced against legends, Poulidor, don't forget him, now Roger De Vlaemnic was more of a 1 day specialist so there were some back then as well (and Eddy still beat them).
So who else Gimondi, Ocana, Thevenet,Maertens,Moser,Sercu, etc....
He defeated some tough hombres.
lets not forget 2 Giro d Lombardia's either
3 paris Nice
1 Tour of Romandy
1 Dauphine
1Midi Libre

the hour record

17 six day races on the track
3 Euro Track Champioships'
7 Belgian madison Champioships (with Sercu)

...Zoetemelk, Godefroot, Verbeeck, Guimard, Janssen, Hoban, Martinez, Vanspringel, Vandenbroucke, Santambrogio, Agostinho, Pesarrodona, Torres...
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
nice additions Rocco

I was gonna put Zoop down. Walter was another, jan a bit long in the tooth but still dangerous, but tough in his early career. This guy (eddy) stomped a pretty loaded talent pool
 

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And now to DS-es and coaches.

rocco said:
...Zoetemelk, Godefroot, Verbeck, Guimard, Janssen, Hoban, Martinez, Vanspringel, Vandenbroucke, Santambrogio, Agostinho, Pesarrodona, Torres...
Since we're on the subject of legacies, one person who is not well-known in the US but has amazing legacy is Cyrille Guimard. His first protege was Hinault, who did not even dare Guimard's tactical genius. Van Impe is said to owe his Tour-winning attack to Guimard's constant prodding for him to be more aggressive.

And then Hinault and Guimard recruited Greg LeMond to Renault-Elf. When Hinault was injured, another protege Laurent Fignon came to the scene. It sounds that Guimard was very much at the helm of Cofidis when they decided to recruit Armstrong.

The question is, any guesses on how well Armstrong former retainers survive now that The Man has retired?
 

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atpjunkie said:
someone said Virenque amonst all these greatest, even in jest you should be shackled to a post and pelted with tomatoes.
Waste of tomatoes!

Heres the top 200 as of 2004 from Cycling4all, who use the UCI ranking system.

<table class="table-general" border="0" height="1275" width="440"><tbody><tr><td class="cell-header-left" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-header-left" width="235">rider/country</td> <td class="cell-header-center" width="75">period</td> <td class="cell-header-right" width="90">points</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">Eddy Merckx (Bel)
Bernard Hinault (Fra)
Sean Kelly (Irl)
Jacques Anquetil (Fra)
Francesco Moser (Ita)
Gino Bartali (Ita)
Felice Gimondi (Ita)
Joop Zoetemelk (Ned)
Fausto Coppi (Ita)
R De Vlaeminck (Bel)</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">1965-78
1975-86
1977-94
1953-69
1973-88
1935-54
1965-78
1970-87
1939-59
1969-87</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">5.844,80
3.312,80
3.074,90
2.937,80
2.880,85
2.860,15
2.625,55
2.518,45
2.510,05
2.497,05</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19 *
20
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">Rik Van Looy (Bel)
Raymond Poulidor (Fra)
Miguel Indurain (Spa)
Laurent Jalabert (Fra)
Tony Rominger (Swi)
Alfredo Binda (Ita)
Louison Bobet (Fra)
Giuseppe Saronni (Ita)
Lance Armstrong (Usa)
Ferdi Kübler (Swi)</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">1953-70
1960-77
1984-96
1989-02
1986-97
1923-36
1947-61
1977-90
1992-04
1940-57</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">2.277,05
2.215,50
2.183,00
2.173,30
2.087,50
2.049,40
1.925,00
1.920,90
1.884,70
1.812,1

</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td></tr><tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29 *
30
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">Freddy Maertens (Bel)
Herman Van Springel (Bel)
Alex Zülle (Swi)
Greg Lemond (Usa)
Fiorenzo Magni (Ita)
Laurent Fignon (Fra)
Costante Girardengo
Nicolas Frantz (Lux)
Jan Ullrich (Ger)
Luis Ocana (Spa)</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">1972-87
1965-81
1991-04
1981-94
1941-56
1982-93
1912-36
1922-34
1994-04
1968-77</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">1.800,10
1.544,70
1.525,75
1.523,95
1.511,65
1.439,45
1.437,60
1.410,55
1.401,50
1.397,45</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">31
32
33
34
35
36 *
37
38
39
40
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">Franco Bitossi (Ita)
Pedro Delgado (Spa)
Jan Janssen (Ned)
C Chiappucci (Ita)
Johan Museeuw (Bel)
Erik Zabel (Ger)
Hugo Koblet (Swi)
Lucien Van Impe (Bel)
Learco Guerra (Ita)
Walter Godefroot (Bel)</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">1961-78
1982-94
1962-72
1985-99
1988-04
1993-04
1946-58
1969-87
1928-41
1965-79</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">1.378,00
1.365,65
1.365,50
1.335,30
1.316,00
1.311,80
1.311,15
1.307,40
1.299,70
1.291,95</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50 *
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">Gianni Bugno (Ita)
Hennie Kuiper (Ned)
Rik Van Steenbergen (Bel)
Antonin Magne (Fra)
Constant Ockers (Bel)
François Faber (Lux)
Gustave Garrigou (Fra)
Stephen Roche (Irl)
Marino Lejarreta (Spa)
Mario Cipollini (Ita)</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">1985-98
1973-88
1943-66
1926-41
1941-56
1906-14
1907-14
1981-93
1979-92
1989-04</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">1.291,75
1.246,10
1.241,80
1.228,30
1.218,45
1.203,50
1.202,95
1.190,20
1.185,60
1.184,10</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="cell-index" width="40">
</td> <td class="cell-general-left" width="235">
</td> <td class="cell-general-center" width="75">
</td> <td class="cell-general-right" width="90">
</td><td style="vertical-align: top;">
</td></tr></tbody></table>Don't seem to see Virenque!

But Van Impe and Bahamontes are there!

God must be a true bike fan!
 
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