[Sanhu]

It's a shame that few buyers on ebay are willing to leave truthful feedbacks for fear of retaliation.

So here the story goes: 2 months ago I bought a higher end bike on ebay that was advertised as full DA group and brand new ("zero miles"). BTW, the seller has a 99.4% rating.

Well the bike arrived w/ signs of probably several months of regular use, and the cassette is Ultegra rather than DA. I sent 4-5 emails to the seller asking for an explanation. He did not respond for 2 weeks, so I filed a paypal dispute.

Within a few hours, the seller re-surfaced, saying his son died in the Iraqi war, and admitted to having test ridden the bike (which was total BS because the mileage was way more than test riding) and pleaded to settle w/ me because his paypal account was frozen due to the dispute.

He offered a partial refund (less than 10%) plus a new DA cassette. So I thought well, let's cut the hero's dad some slack and agreed.

So I dropped the dispute and waited for the cassette to arrive. 3 weeks passed, nothing showed up. So I emailed him twice, still no response. The third time, I emailed him that I would post negative feedback if he keeps hiding. Well, WITHIN 2 HOURS, he showed up and said I needed to return the original Ultegra part in order to receive the DA one. Otherwise he would'nt send me anything. "if you don't like it, tuff sh*t", he wrote.

It's not much money, but I am just sad that someone would make up a war hero story to rip off a fellow cyclist. And it makes me sad that ebayers wouldn't use feedback to defend themselves, because it's obvious the guy is a pretty shitty seller but has very high rating.

Oh, well.

BTW, in case you say I am being nickpicking, here is a picture of the stem I took off the bike right after I opened the box.

 

[Argentius]

Blah.

It doesn't sound like you were burned all that badly, at least... but hopefully it's a lesson not to drop disputes until you get complete resolution!

Some sellers are shyte, some buyers are shyte, but one great thing about eBay is that estabilished sellers and buyers are pretty entrenched, and the feedback / dispute / paypal system works pretty well...

Hope nothing was terribly damaged on your new bike! At least leave a followup with his feedback...

 

[Sanhu]

I am not burnt badly at all. In the grand scheme of things, it's nothing (however if I bid on a DA cassette stand alone and receive an Ultegra, I'd be p*ssed;-)).

The point I was making though was in this case the feedback system is not working at all. The guy has 99+% rating but really is quite questionable.

 

[Howzitbroke]

No, not all, just like people you actually meet. It is truly rare to find complete honesty.

 

[Sanhu]

That's true. You often hear people say "XXX is a great guy" even though XXX could well be an A-hole. But few want to risk "not being nice" by saying the truth.

 

[pavedroad]

Yeah, I pretty much just file disputes and ignore any requests to settle outside of Ebay. This way if the dude doesn't fix the problem, I can at least claim some buyer protection.

 

[Howzitbroke]

An ass is an ass in my world. I'd fill you in if it was necessary, and may even let the ass know.

 

[alienator]

Are all people who ask stupid, obviously wrong generalizing questions idiots?

Obviously, since eBay is so popular, you'll meet people just as you would on the street. Some are honest, some aren't. Some are something else in between.

Hopefully you'll get over your generalization.

 

[zooog]

To be hones5t, I think you got screwed. Guy was an ass and he knows he screwed you. I agree with your comments that........ "It's a shame that few buyers on ebay are willing to leave truthful feedbacks for fear of retaliation."

 

[steel515]

After many transactions including some bad, I now freely leave neutral or negative feedback, not for my gain, but for future people who might encounter this person. What's the meaning of feedback if everyone's is positive? In my experience generally people with 98% or less are possibly selling defective/misrepresented products though not always the case.
I used to think those with high rating ie over 1000 are automatically trustworthy though not always the case. Ironically, these dishonest people like in this article are afraid of neutral/negative feedback as it exposes them. They might threaten to give me negative feedback but I don't worry about "retailation" because I feel the truth will come out in the long run. I want to warn you all of buying from those drop-off-to sell at ebay places. I had a bad experiences and judging from others with high negatives, I won't buy regardless of price. Some people drop off defective goods untested, "as-is," seller doesn't know and not responsible for knowing about condition of item and shipping can be high.

 

[steel515]

double

 

[fisherman]

I agree - you got screwed. New means New. Dura-ace means Dura-ace. What is happening to the world nowdays?

 

[SkiDiver]

I think what really blows is that sellers won't leave feedback for buyers until buyers have left feedback for them, thereby holding the buyer hostage for good feeback. I even got an email to this effect when I hadn't left feedback for a (good) seller yet.

The buyer should receive feedback based on prompt payment, and maybe good communication, nothing else. What other obligation does a buyer have?

I think ebay should have a system where the seller has to leave feedback first.

 

[terry b]

Well, clearly you were taken on that deal. And I agree with you about people not leaving negative feedback. But, eBay pretty much trains all users that your rating matters, and for small buyers/sellers, one bad retaliation can make you look like a ne'er-do-well. It's sort of like your credit score, miss that one $11 payment to Sears and you're explaining it to every loan officer for the rest of your life.

I recently had my first semi-negative deal. Bought a Yeti ARC MTB frame at a very good price (5/8 of retail) that was advertised as "new, unbuilt, unridden." Well, following the fiasco where the seller tried to ship it UPS to my PO Box, the frame arrived. I immediately knew it was not as advertised. Minor pinch on the seat tube from the derailleur, quick release marks on the drop outs, paint out of the threads on the disk attachment points, minor cable rub on the head tube and seat cluster. Judging from the condition, I guessed it was a shop demo. The wear was pretty light, but it wasn't new. So I contacted the seller. Told him so. Well, I was offered a refund, he denied knowing that it wasn't new, blah, blah, blah. I finally told him I felt the price was reasonable, and that I would keep it, but that I didn't like being deceived. He denied lying, but c'mon, he owns a bike shop and knows damn well what he sold me.

So I labored about feedback, knowing full well if I slammed him I ran the risk of getting slammed myself for no reason. Finally, I went with Neutral and in the comments said "not as advertised, full refund offered, decided to keep it." I think that passed on the gist of the transaction and was honest. He never left any feedback for me. Reading back through his hundreds of customer comments though, I found several instances of "sold as new, it's not" from other people.

What I found most interesting was eBays warning that Neutral was a serious step. Again, it dissuades people from doing the right thing. But to your original question, I don't think people are cowards, I think the way the system is designed is to give an appearance that eveyone is loverly and that all transactions are characterized by little lambs and bunnies. In those conditions, people don't want to get muddied unfairly, and so many will just not give the truth.

 

[Speedy]

I recently bought something that I never receive. The seller charged me for insurance, but sent it insured - and claimed no responsibility for the lost item.

I left negative feedback, and he replied with negative retaliation saying it was somehow my fault. I wrote to ebay, and they wouldn’t do anything about.

Nice system - not!

 

[hogleg62]

I'm with SkiDiver

Once the buyer has promptly paid Ebay should require the seller to leave the feedback. I always post feedback immediately, seems like the right thing to do. If the seller won't post in a timely manner. Don't post feedback at all.

 

[Snapster]

Just recently happened to me < 2 weeks ago

I bought a jersey and bibs, which from his description sounded good and the price seemed reasonable, but the bibs had a 2" seam tear in the middle of the chest. I asked him to refund the bib cost ($15), but got no response. As soon as I posted negative feedback, they posted negative feedback saying I was misrepresenting the "facts". The facts were that the jersey smelled like cologne (even after 2 washings) and the bibs were torn. But, Ebay won't do anything, so they best I can do is reply to his negative feedback. Sucks, I had 100% positive till then. Here's the link to the item: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=58066&item=7228729618

Mike

 

[KenS]

Ebayers suffer from NEW car/bike syndrome

Many ebayers won't post negative or neutral ratings because they are afraid that a negative retaliation score will ruin their 100% approval rating. It is the new car/bike syndrome where you will go to great lengths to avoid that first scratch.

Ken

 

[Matno]

Once the buyer has promptly paid Ebay should require the seller to leave the feedback. I always post feedback immediately, seems like the right thing to do. If the seller won't post in a timely manner. Don't post feedback at all.

I agree. The seller should be required to post feedback within a shorter amount of time than the buyer. Once the payment has been made in a timely matter, the seller has no reason to leave negative feedback. If the buyer is dissatisfied, that's usually because the seller either didn't accurately describe the product or because they didn't get insurance. (I always ship insured, even if the seller doesn't want to pay for it).

I've left negative or neutral feedback before, but I always wait until the other person has posted feedback. if they don't, I wait until the last possible second to post the feedback and leave it when it's too late for them to "retaliate." I bend over backward to please on eBay, so I'm not worried about anyone ACTUALLY having an issue worth leaving negative feedback, but I also worry about ruining my 100% positive record...

 

[Sanhu]

Here is an update:

I said goodbye to the DA cassette and left neg feedback for the seller. Can't be a coward myself now that I am complaining about others. ;-)