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If I was going to plunk down some major jing for a custom frame, I might look first at the "old wave" of framebuilders. If someone has been been in business for 10-15 years, they must be doing something right. Sometimes, the "best" and "new wave" of frames aren't really the best.
 

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MR_GRUMPY said:
If I was going to plunk down some major jing for a custom frame, I might look first at the "old wave" of framebuilders. If someone has been been in business for 10-15 years, they must be doing something right. Sometimes, the "best" and "new wave" of frames aren't really the best.
If you look closer at that list, you'll notice that many do fit your criteria. Myself, Sycip, Curtis Inglis and Carl Strong have all been at it for around 15 years. Curt Goodrich has built under other names for a very long time, too. I'm sure some of the other guys have the same story.

It's only "next wave" compared to guys like Richie, who've been at it forever.
 

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The term "new wave" was probably used to attract the "trendy" bike buyers. Like I said, anyone in the business for 15 years, must know their stuff.
It bothers me that good workmanship is called "new wave."
 

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MR_GRUMPY said:
The term "new wave" was probably used to attract the "trendy" bike buyers. Like I said, anyone in the business for 15 years, must know their stuff.
It bothers me that good workmanship is called "new wave."
I see your point, thanks for clarifying.

Jim Kish
 

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What does Richard Sachs know about framebuilding anyway?

team_sheepshead said:
richie sachs has updated his web page that shows his picks for the "new wave" of frame builders. here's a link to his announcement:
http://www.frameforum.net/forum2/index.php?showtopic=1404

and here's a link to his page:
http://www.richardsachs.com/nextwave.html

nice to see my personal favorite, mike zanconato, is still on the list. i hope he gets my frame done before he is swamped with new orders! :)
;)

Can't hurt to have a good word from a master pushing your product.....

I am not all that familiar with all of the builders listed but those I do know about are indeed first rate. Still as a very satisfied customer I'm likely to stick with Waterford.

OTOH I keep dreaming about a Vanilla.....
 

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I've got this 'next wave' builder built frame sitting in my office right now - built up, of course, and with real (drop) bars.



It is a blast to ride and is great for my 45 mile daily commute with longer weeknd rides.
I've got no problems recommending Jim's work. I'm actually trying to figure out how I can afford to have him build me a Ti SS 'cross frame.
 

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Yeah, these are all pretty established builders. I'm not sure why Hampsten is on here since he subcontracts everything. 'New Wave' for me would be young builders just starting out. Anyone interested in custom who is on a budget should ask around locally. In big metro areas there are usually lots of little builders trying to get their name out there who might be willing to build a frame for a lot cheaper than some of the big boys listed here. Of course then you end up being a guinea pig.
 

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Henry Chinaski said:
. 'New Wave' for me would be young builders just starting out...
no arguments here but, the only person that used the term 'New Wave' was team_sheepshead in his post. Sachs used the term 'Next Wave' probably meaning the next generation of frame builders after his generation.
 

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typo...my bad.

good one, henry.

FTM said:
no arguments here but, the only person that used the term 'New Wave' was team_sheepshead in his post. Sachs used the term 'Next Wave' probably meaning the next generation of frame builders after his generation.
 

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MR_GRUMPY said:
The term "new wave" was probably used to attract the "trendy" bike buyers. Like I said, anyone in the business for 15 years, must know their stuff.
It bothers me that good workmanship is called "new wave."
Grumpy-issimo
man - it's rough reading some of this thread as well as a few
emails as a result. this list went up on my site on dec 04 and
the text was finally added a year later. this compilation has
been online for 13 months. why and who are on it are clearly
explained in the first person text that appears on the page -
which is on my site.
if anyone has any questions about the validity of my choices*,
the text should address it. fwiw, the entire idea was planted
as the original show in houston was in its seedling stage. i
posted to that effect last february elsewhere:
http://search.bikelist.org/getmsg.asp?Filename=framebuilders.10501.0877.eml
and
http://www.frameforum.net/forum2/index.php?showtopic=651&hl=next+wave

this is not about what was or even what is, it's about
what could be with respect to our little corner of the
world. nothing more, nothing less.
e-RICHIE

*from the web page:
"Those listed are representative of a cross-section of people..."

oh - and the others were correct. the page does not
use the header "new wave".
 

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MB1 said:
;)

Can't hurt to have a good word from a master pushing your product.....

I am not all that familiar with all of the builders listed but those I do know about are indeed first rate. Still as a very satisfied customer I'm likely to stick with Waterford.

OTOH I keep dreaming about a Vanilla.....

I like the way the Vanilla's Look but homeboy came off as a total d!ckhead when I contacted him for frame I wanted built a few years ago. At the time he was not willing to do custom top tube but was willing to do custom angles and paint. To me this made him a custom painter and not a custom builder.
 

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teoteoteo said:
I like the way the Vanilla's Look but homeboy came off as a total d!ckhead when I contacted him for frame I wanted built a few years ago. At the time he was not willing to do custom top tube but was willing to do custom angles and paint. To me this made him a custom painter and not a custom builder.

a custom builder isn't necessarily one who executes
a fantasy design or something that may seem protoypical;
some builders simply meld correct fit and contact points
with frame designs that they know will "work well". a top
tube's length is only one element in obtaining the reach
you need to have. top tube, head angle, and stem all have
an equal effect when it comes to getting your upper body
properly positioned. these numbers also must work with
the rest of the bicycle frame that that "fit" and everything
else works as a whole.
e-RICHIE
 

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e-RICHIE said:
a custom builder isn't necessarily one who executes
a fantasy design or something that may see protoypical;
some builders simply meld correct fit and contact points
with frame designs that they know will "work well". a top
tube's length is only one element in obtaining the reach
you need to have. top tube, head angle, and stem all have
an equal effect when it comes to getting your upper body
properly positioned. these numbers also must work with
the rest of the bicycle frame that that "fit" and everything
else works as a whole.
e-RICHIE
What you said is a nice general disclaimer but the fact is I asked him to build a plain jane compact steel bike. I asked if he would build the bike with custom dimensions. He said he would only do custom angles. He was a bike frame welder with custom paint options and not a custom builder in my eyes.
 

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teoteoteo said:
What you said is a nice general disclaimer but the fact is I asked him to build a plain jane compact steel bike. I asked if he would build the bike with custom dimensions. He said he would only do custom angles.
a minute or two on a head angle lean will compensate
for some length on a top tube. you still "end up" in the
same place whether you use the angle or the top
tube length to achieve it. perhaps he was concerned
that resultant measurements from the several that you
actually chose might skew the overall design. i know
my antenae goes up on this issue.
teoteoteo said:
He was a bike frame welder with custom paint options and not a custom builder in my eyes.
i guess we can each have a list then, eh.
 

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teoteoteo said:
I like the way the Vanilla's Look but homeboy came off as a total d!ckhead when I contacted him for frame I wanted built a few years ago. At the time he was not willing to do custom top tube but was willing to do custom angles and paint. To me this made him a custom painter and not a custom builder.
teoteoteo,

I have seen you post this before. I think you have me confused with someone else.

Every frame I build is one of a kind. From seat tube angle to tt length, fork length, fork rake, chainstay length, tire clearance, brake type etc. Each frame is designed and built from the ground up. I do not work from any sort of stock frame template that is tweaked into "custom". It has always been this way...

Perhaps it was just a simple misunderstanding.

Sacha White
Vanilla Bicycles
 
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