Road Bike, Cycling Forums banner
1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Compulsive bike builder
Joined
·
19 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anyone have any experience with Campy and D/A 10 speed compatibility?

I currently run Ergo 10 shifters with an Ultegra 9 rear, using the cable routing trick, and it works great. Is the D/A 10 cassette spaced out the same as the Campy 10? What combos have people tried, with our without success?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,160 Posts
here's the scoop...

Since Campy 10 shifters have too much cable pull for a Shimano 9-speed system, they will have way too much for the Shimano 10-speed system. If you want to use Campy levers, it will require an adapting device that reduces the cable pull. A couple of companies make these things for Shimano 9 speed systems, but it will probably be awhile before they make one for the 10 speed.

Most people want to know if a Campy wheel will work on a Shimnao drivetrain or vice versa. The short answer is yes, but not perfectly, just like trying to swap wheels on the two 9-speed systems. Here are more details on that:

The cog spacing on Campy 10 is 4.12mm and Shimano 10 is 3.90 or 3.95 (depending on whose figures you believe). The difference is .17mm per shift. If the derailleur was set perfectly to center at the middle of the cassette, the error would accumulate to a minimum of 4.5 x .17 = .77mm at either extreme, which is a 19.5% error. If the shimano spacing is only 3.90mm, then the error accumulates to at least 4.5 x .22 = .99mm, which is a 25.6% error.

Compare this to the 9 speed mismatch of 4.55mm - 4.32mm = .23mm. After four shifts in either direction, the positioning error accumulates to .92mm, which is a 20% error.

The numbers show that the accumulative error is about the same as the 9 speed mismatch.

When trying this swap, be sure to try to get the derailleur cable tension set to center the derailleur at the middle of the cassette, to minimize the error.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
591 Posts
campy/shiamno 10

.....................Despite the math, several people have done the Campy 10 wheel/cassette, Shimano drivetrain deal and it works well.Same for the other way around.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,160 Posts
sure it will work..

But just because the chain goes over the cog doesn't mean that the derailleur is properly aligned which is important for minimum noise and maximum longevity of the parts. What the numbers show is that's the 10 speed swap is no better than the 9 speed. There is still a significant positioning error.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
591 Posts
campy/shimano 10

....................The folks who tried it could not tell the difference.. Slop in the upper pulley takes care of the difference. People in the business (Sheldon Brown, among others) of selling the stuff and keeping customers happy have been doing the 9 speed mismatch for years. Often, the 'paper error' does not work out that way in actual practice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,160 Posts
not that sloppy...

The float in the derailleur's upper pulley is used up on the first two shifts, IF the derailleur is PERFECTLY centered. It will not make up for all of the positioning error.

I've measured the float on a Campy derailleur, it's about .4mm, just enough to cover 2 shifts worth of error. The lower pully has no float, so the chain will run crooked between the pulleys. Can't help but create more noise and wear.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
The wear isn't that bad.

I've run a Campy 7 a shimano set of 9 speed wheels for several years now.
I average about 8k mles a year, I change my chain twice a year, I replace my Campy cassette about every 1 1/2 to 2 yrs & the shimano cassette about every 2 - 3 yrs, )doesn't see as many miles).
While I don't race I do the local training rides weigh about 175.
I agree with C 40 on an earlier post, that is to buy your wheels to match your drive train.
However, my interes in this (as I'm sure are others) is that if you have a set of wheels already, can they be made to work withthe components you now have.
 

·
Every little counts...
Joined
·
3,924 Posts
Wheels: Don't forget, if you have Campagnolo hubs, you can purchase a new shimano-compatible freehub body to run them on a shimano bike. You cannot switch on shimano, however. OTOH: Do the new DA wheels come in a Campagnolo compatible freehub?

I am perhaps interested in going with a new DA crank & BB once my chorus wears out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
777 Posts
Spunout said:
Wheels: Don't forget, if you have Campagnolo hubs, you can purchase a new shimano-compatible freehub body to run them on a shimano bike. You cannot switch on shimano, however. OTOH: Do the new DA wheels come in a Campagnolo compatible freehub?

I am perhaps interested in going with a new DA crank & BB once my chorus wears out.
Just out of curiosity, what do you define as "worn out" for a crank? The lifespan of a crank has got to be over 100k, given the number of 1970's Nuovo Record cranks still on the road. I've got customers that run Super Record and C-Record cranks on their 9 and 10 speed Ergo bikes.

When the BB wears out, wich should be over 20K, unless Campy bearings have really gone in the dump, get a Phil Wood, and never worry about it again.

Remember, if you must install Shimano parts on Campy bikes, you must lubricate all points of contact with extra-virgin olive oil, or Tullio's ghost will haunt your bike, resulting in untold woe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
'curiosity'

Every serious cyclist knows that you can tell a worn out crank by comparing it to pictures of the newest cranks in the catalogs! (Especiallythe all carbon ones! - not that I've ever done that)

JimPz
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
117 Posts
Got a link that describes the "cable routing trick" ??

Does it work with Ergo 9 speed shifters as well ? Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,160 Posts
no...

9 speed shifters will pull more cable per shift than 10 speed shifters. You would need to replace the rachet wheel with a 10-speed version to get this to work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
DirtDad said:
Does anyone have any experience with Campy and D/A 10 speed compatibility?

I currently run Ergo 10 shifters with an Ultegra 9 rear, using the cable routing trick, and it works great. Is the D/A 10 cassette spaced out the same as the Campy 10? What combos have people tried, with our without success?

or use a american classic or wheels manufacturing 10spd shimano splined, campy drive train compatible cassette(what I use)---be a bit cheaper than a DA 10spd..and then you wouldn't really have to worry about the drive train..
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top