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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am wanting to buy a pair of OEM clincher carbon wheels but am unsure which ones to go for. Besides the different sizes their are 2 types I know of that I am looking at. One is full carbon and the other has the carbon molded onto an alloy rim.

Originally I was going to get full carbon (38mm front, 50mm back) as they weighed about 1350gms for the 2 wheels and I thought they would be fast on the flats as well as while climbing. But then I heard that it is harder to brake with full carbon (diff. brake pads?) and that your pads wear out quickly. Being 95kg at present and also considering myself a heavy user of the brakes (especially with downhill descending and tight corners, I'm a little nervous), I thought these may not suit me because of the braking issues. Is this true? Also if the rear wheel was spoked with a 2 cross over (24 to 28 spokes) would that be strong enough to hold my weight?

So I am thinking now, that perhaps I should get the type that mold onto the alloy rim (abt 1650gms for 48mm model - I am hoping). Solves the braking issue Am I safe in thinking that these are stronger than full carbon and will be faster on the flats because of the extra weight?

I currently have a pair of American Classic Victory's (also 1650gms) with about 24mm rim . Can I expect a noticeable improvement on the flats with the 48mm alloy/carbon rims? Lastly, what difference can I expect with the full carbon's vs the alloy/carbons while climbing given that there is about a 300gms difference?

Sorry abt the million questions, just torn between the 2.
 

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Answers

Bridgey said:
I am wanting to buy a pair of OEM clincher carbon wheels but am unsure which ones to go for. Besides the different sizes their are 2 types I know of that I am looking at. One is full carbon and the other has the carbon molded onto an alloy rim.

Originally I was going to get full carbon (38mm front, 50mm back) as they weighed about 1350gms for the 2 wheels and I thought they would be fast on the flats as well as while climbing. But then I heard that it is harder to brake with full carbon (diff. brake pads?) and that your pads wear out quickly. Being 95kg at present and also considering myself a heavy user of the brakes (especially with downhill descending and tight corners, I'm a little nervous), I thought these may not suit me because of the braking issues. Is this true? Also if the rear wheel was spoked with a 2 cross over (24 to 28 spokes) would that be strong enough to hold my weight?

So I am thinking now, that perhaps I should get the type that mold onto the alloy rim (abt 1650gms for 48mm model - I am hoping). Solves the braking issue Am I safe in thinking that these are stronger than full carbon and will be faster on the flats because of the extra weight?

I currently have a pair of American Classic Victory's (also 1650gms) with about 24mm rim . Can I expect a noticeable improvement on the flats with the 48mm alloy/carbon rims? Lastly, what difference can I expect with the full carbon's vs the alloy/carbons while climbing given that there is about a 300gms difference?
You will get different views on the braking issue. Some claim no problems with CF braking surfaces, while others will tell you that braking is the big issue with CF rims.

Regards performance, since you haven't noted the brand/model it's hard to say how much of a speed increase you will get on the flats. However, the very fastest aero rims (which yours probably are not) will give you 0.3 mph at 20 mph compared to a 32 spoke box section rim. If you are time trialing, this is very significant, but if you are riding in a group it won't mean much. Just for perspective, that speed difference would make you about 4 minutes faster over 100 miles.

As far as the weight difference when climbing, 300 grams is 0.3% weight saved in your "total system" (bike + rider) and when climbing a 6% grade at 250 watts that weight saving would make you 0.036 mph faster. That's 190 feet every hour, or 16 seconds saved. Can you say "not much" ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks you've been very helpful, if I get them, I guess I should get them with extra speed in mind on the flats. approx 1min every 40km's is not so bad vs 16secs for 1hr of climbing. Perhaps the look is also a motivating factor.
 

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Also keep in mind that deep dish rims, while they make you more aerodynamic, aren't much fun in a cross wind. It's hard to hold a straight line wind the wind gusts.
 

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When I was doing my search for carbon tubular wheels I have set my mind on a set of 7850-C50-TU 50mm tubular wheels, but I was amazed to see this graphic about wheelset aerodynamics in which the power absorbed of the C50 is very similar to the C24. really very close

https://accel95.mettre-put-idata.over...ro_english.jpg

on the other side, the power needed to accelerate the C24 is much less than the C50

https://a10.idata.over-blog.com/0/02/...ia_june_08.jpg

After that I think now the 7850-C24-TU is all that I would need. aerodynamic enough ( 28mm front, 24mm back ) and light.
 

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Bridgey, Hi

I've a pair of Reynolds Assault C, and a 2010 Shimano Dura-Ace C-24. All my rides are done on Hillie roads and I'd average 3000ft (8to15% grade) climbing every 30 miles with lotsa wind condition.

I'd,find my self ridding the Reynolds over the Shimano 8 out of 10 rides, even though the C-24s are lighter the Reynolds just maintain speed so much easier that, my average speed is 1.5 to 2 miles faster consistently then the Shimanos on a 50 miles rides, sometimes higher.

Braking wise the Shimano surface is like a Brazilian girl after a bikini wax, its like silk there is no pulsing or abruptly braking. Its very easy to modulate your brakes.

The, Reynolds on the other hand it has a bit of pulse and heaths up a little more, also more grabby - I'd use Swiss Stops yellow braking pads.

Cross Winds, is True its a little weird or sketchy on your first few rides, however you do get used to it and eventually you forget about and learn how to deal with it.

If, you're a climber by heart get the C-24 if you need a wheel that can do everything and it will not break the bank. I would go for the Reynolds or the new Easton EC-90SL.

Regards Luciano
 

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Tests were done on wheels for weight vs aerodynamics. The conclusion was that for the pros, the weight became more important once the gradient got over 8%. For the amateurs it was about 6%.

For your riding I would say something in the zipp 303 or 404 range, or the Reynolds DV46 would be the best blend.
 

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Just checking

pvflyer said:
I'd,find my self ridding the Reynolds over the Shimano 8 out of 10 rides, even though the C-24s are lighter the Reynolds just maintain speed so much easier that, my average speed is 1.5 to 2 miles faster consistently then the Shimanos on a 50 miles rides, sometimes higher.
Just checking: are you saying the Reynolds are 1.5-2 mph faster than the Shimano? Even if you are saying that you can cover 1.5-2 miles more in the same time for a 50 mile ride (0.6-0.8 mph faster), this is WAY outside the data generated by a large number of wind tunnel and road tests. I will challenge you and say that, barring some sort of serious bearing problem with the Shimano, there is no way that your wheels are making that kind of speed difference.
 

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Kerry Irons said:
Just checking: are you saying the Reynolds are 1.5-2 mph faster than the Shimano? Even if you are saying that you can cover 1.5-2 miles more in the same time for a 50 mile ride (0.6-0.8 mph faster), this is WAY outside the data generated by a large number of wind tunnel and road tests. I will challenge you and say that, barring some sort of serious bearing problem with the Shimano, there is no way that your wheels are making that kind of speed difference.
Exactly what I've said. And my Garmin confirms and its nothing wrong with my shimano. You, will maintain a high average speed with the deep sided wheel is that simple! On, my type of riding and terrain the Reynolds its faster then my Shimano.

BTW, do you've the wheels? Cause, I do. I don't just go by what I've read on some publication.

If, you're a local we can ride Pinos or Baldy,let me know when,If you want to do a little trip I'm doing Haleakala again this come July, Paia/Haleakala I'm challenging U.

Regards
 

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I ride similar type terrain, don't have a Garmin, but I feel/see the same thing with my DV46s when compared to my Rolf Vigors and Easton Orion IIs. With the DV46s it takes less effort and concentration to produce the same or higher average speed riding solo over the same courses. I have come to believe this after 100s of solo rides.

BTW, pvflyer I love your bike. The carbon weave look great on that frame.
 

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jmess said:
BTW, pvflyer I love your bike. The carbon weave look great on that frame.
THNX

Nice, Vette ............



Best Regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I've decided to go for the alloy/carbon style. As I've just dished out about $2500 US for my new pedal force CG1 bike (minus the wheels and pedals), my wife isn't keen on me spending too much more.

So I am thinking about using my American Classic Victory's (1650gms) for more hilly courses (whole bike will weight 6.8kg's) and perhaps purchase these OEM rims http://www.flyxii.com/products_1.asp?menuid=320&id=348 for flatter courses and potentially racing. What do you think?

The problem is, the rims weigh 620 grms each for a 42mm carbon/alloy rim. But at about $150 US for the pair (cheaper on ebay) I really can't complain. I can get the hubs/skewers (about 400grms) for between $75 to $130 from either the same place http://www.flyxii.com/products_1.asp?menuid=320&id=345 or e hongfu http://www.e-hongfu-bikes.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=80&products_id=198 and then just need to buy the spokes and build them myself (have had some experience).

So all up for about $300 US I can have a 42mm alloy/carbon wheel set that weighs about 1900gms. What do you think? Are there better alternatives that aren't much more expensive?
 

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Bridgey said:
I've decided to go for the alloy/carbon style. As I've just dished out about $2500 US for my new pedal force CG1 bike (minus the wheels and pedals), my wife isn't keen on me spending too much more.

So I am thinking about using my American Classic Victory's (1650gms) for more hilly courses (whole bike will weight 6.8kg's) and perhaps purchase these OEM rims http://www.flyxii.com/products_1.asp?menuid=320&id=348 for flatter courses and potentially racing. What do you think?

The problem is, the rims weigh 620 grms each for a 42mm carbon/alloy rim. But at about $150 US for the pair (cheaper on ebay) I really can't complain. I can get the hubs/skewers (about 400grms) for between $75 to $130 from either the same place http://www.flyxii.com/products_1.asp?menuid=320&id=345 or e hongfu http://www.e-hongfu-bikes.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=80&products_id=198 and then just need to buy the spokes and build them myself (have had some experience).

So all up for about $300 US I can have a 42mm alloy/carbon wheel set that weighs about 1900gms. What do you think? Are there better alternatives that aren't much more expensive?
I think 1900 grams is pretty heavy, but you're only paying $300.

Do yourself a favor and visit this subforum, if you haven't already. Look into custom-built wheels. I'm willing to bet you can get a lot lighter wheelset for a not obscene amount of money and you would be supporting a small business (if that's you're thing). A few years ago I had a set of 1320 gram clinchers built up for $700.
 

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pvflyer said:
Exactly what I've said. And my Garmin confirms and its nothing wrong with my shimano. You, will maintain a high average speed with the deep sided wheel is that simple! On, my type of riding and terrain the Reynolds its faster then my Shimano.
I wasn't questioning whether the Reynolds are faster than Shimano. I was saying that the fastest wheels on the planet are good for 0.3 mph at 20 mph, and 0.4 mph at 25 mph when compared to 32 spoke box section rim wheels. That's all.
 

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Can anyone tell me where I can get a set of Campy Bora One 2010 wheels for wholesale cost? I live in the USA but I will buy from any responsible seller...
 

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Can anyone tell me if the burnished spokes and the aluminum hubs on the new 2010 Campy Bora One wheels will perform as well as the carbon hubs and the stainless steel spokes on the 2009 Bora Ulta wheels? (not the new Bora twos) I would have to spend about $680.00 more for the later and is it worth is?
 
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