[wily in pacifica]

I just had the rear hub on one of my Chris King wheels serviced. Now the hub does not spin as freely as any of my other CK rear wheels.

When I did my scientific research in the garage it seems like the serviced wheel will spin half as long as a broken-in rear CK wheel when I spin it with about equal force.

I have a long ride/race this weekend and wondered if this will effect my performance. My thinking is that the effect is similar to having the brake rubbing.

If it was only a short ride I wouldn't worry about it and eventually my guess is it too will break in. But this is an extreamly long ride/race and any negative effect of these wheels may get to me in the long run.

Willy in Pacifica

 

[Kerry Irons]

Possibly grease

IWhen I did my scientific research in the garage it seems like the serviced wheel will spin half as long as a broken-in rear CK wheel when I spin it with about equal force. My thinking is that the effect is similar to having the brake rubbing.

Most likely this is just due to new grease. If it was similar to brake rubbing, the wheel wouldn't even make one revolution. Take the wheel out of the frame, remove the QR skewer, and turn the axle with a light touch of your fingers, and feel for binding. If it turns smoothly, then the added friction is minimal and not an issue. If you feel binding, then things were done poorly when the hub was serviced.

 

[wily in pacifica]

Hub Service

I agree it is only to the new grease during the service as the wheel does not bind in any way.

But the wheel does not spin as freely as any other wheel for now. I am just wondering if that would make a difference over the long run of a long ride.

When I say a long ride, and it is technically a race, I am talking over 300 miles in a 24 hour TT. I am worried it might get to my legs later in the race.

I can always change the wheels but these are the wheels I have been riding with this bike and I hate to change anything the week beforehand without getting out on a ride.

Willy in Pacifica

 

[Orb]

I'd be curious to know what grease the mechanic put in there. King hubs should not be serviced with normal wheel bearing grease...I used very light synthetic lube in mine when I owned Kings, and King specifies RingDrive grease for the rear hub. If the wrong grease was used, I'd pull the hub apart and clean it out and put lighter synthetic in.

 

[bikeboy389]

But the wheel does not spin as freely as any other wheel for now. I am just wondering if that would make a difference over the long run of a long ride.

When I say a long ride, and it is technically a race, I am talking over 300 miles in a 24 hour TT. I am worried it might get to my legs later in the race.

Do you expect to win or challenge for, say, the top 5% of this race? How close are the finishing times? Do you expect to get off the bike, even once, to take a "natural break" of some sort? Do you risk getting a flat at some point? Do you slow down pedaling to stretch your legs or eat/drink?

My point in asking this is not to get answers, but to get you to look at things realistically. Yes, the miniscule (and it IS miniscule) amount of extra resistance you'll face can theoretically add up, especially over the length of course you're looking at. But if the finishing times don't tend to be closer than 1 second to each other, I doubt you'd notice the difference. If you don't expect to challenge for a high place, what's the difference of a second or two? If you get off the bike for any reason, there are millions of variables that can cost you much more time than the too-heavy grease.

This last questions, though, are probably the most important. Are you gonna dwell on this the whole race, and then if you do poorly, are you gonna blame your hub? If the answer to either of these is even remotely like yes, then spare yourself, and anyone who has to talk to you after the race, a lot of annoyance and get the hub cleaned and re-lubed properly.

 

[wily in pacifica]

Thanks BikeBoy,

My only concern was the fact that the wheel will only coast half as long as another similar wheel. If my brake was rubbing to cause this I would assume this would be a huge penalty over any distance. So I was trying to find out if the grease problem can be compared to something like a rubbing brake.

So I guess I am not convinced that the issue is "miniscule" since a rubbing brake is not a miniscule issue.

My goal is not to win the thing as there are a few RAAM folks out there. But I just want to see how far I can ride in 24 hours.

I believe the biggest factor will be weather and wind which I cannot do anything about.

So I think I may go ahead and switch my rear wheel so like you said I will not dwell on it.

 

[bikeboy389]

Thanks BikeBoy,

My only concern was the fact that the wheel will only coast half as long as another similar wheel. If my brake was rubbing to cause this I would assume this would be a huge penalty over any distance. So I was trying to find out if the grease problem can be compared to something like a rubbing brake.

Since you're concerned about it, I'd say you're definitely smart to just swap it out for the race. You'll feel better about the whole deal, and for a long race, especially a time trial, that's got to count for a fair amount.

I think you're making a major mis-assumption about this though, and the concept of coasting uncovers it. Yes, the unencumbered wheel could spin only half as long. But there's very little mass associated with the wheel by itself compared to the wheel on the bike with you on it. The rotating mass of the wheel is only enough to break the viscosity of the grease for a little while. When you're on the bike coasting, there's a heck of a lot more momentum on your side, because you're so much heavier and already moving, and the viscosity issue becomes very small indeed relative to the forces involved. If your rim weighed 100 lbs, I bet the wheel would spin a lot longer. When you're pedaling, the issue's the same--the drag of the hub is very small overall. Way more than not having the drag, but a tiny fraction of what's going on on top of the bike--a flappy windbreaker might create more drag on you.

You could think of it this way, too. The over-greased hub spins half as long as a properly-greased one when you just spin it in the bike. How long do you think a wheel would spin if a brake pad were dragging? Might not even get a full revolution. That's dozens of times the amount of drag the heavy grease is creating.

You're right to think it's a similar effect to a dragging brake, but I believe you're doing yourself a disservice thinking there's any comparison between the amounts of drag created. And hey--if the grease broke down over the 300 miles, your bike would get easier and easier to ride, right?

 

[wily in pacifica]

[BikeBoy,

thanks again. Someone else mentioned a few of your points so I think I will just use the wheel since it is the one that has been serviced and the one that I has been using on this bike.

Plus this will give me an excuse if I do not make my goal. OK just kidding. But by the end of the ride I will see how much better it works so al least this ride will be the break in for it.

This ride is actually a test ride for a longer ride so I am not as concerned about my mileage as how well I feel over the day and how well I keep my energy/calories up.

willy in pacifica

 

[cdmc]

Stick with the wheel for the ride if for no other reason than because you know it works properly. Switching components right before a ride where reliability is important is a big no-no.

 

[litespeedchick]

This may be a propos of nothing, but....my CK hub on my mountain bike was serviced a couple of months ago. The rear hub is so tight I have a hard time back pedaling...which has affected my ability to get restarted on a hill several times. Granted, I have only ridden about once a week since then, but how LONG should I have to put up with this?

 

[bikeboy389]

This may be a propos of nothing, but....my CK hub on my mountain bike was serviced a couple of months ago. The rear hub is so tight I have a hard time back pedaling...which has affected my ability to get restarted on a hill several times. Granted, I have only ridden about once a week since then, but how LONG should I have to put up with this?

That sounds like a major issue--much worse than Wily's. I'd say you've already put up with it too long. You should take it back to wherever it was serviced and complain. They may not be willing to admit fault, since it's been a while, but you can claim (truthfully) that you thought it would break in, but it never did, and that's why you waited so long.

Don't get mad, and don't make threats, but be insistent. They can hardly claim to have done their jobs properly if it's worse after their "servicing."

Or you could learn to service it yourself and do the job properly.

 

[litespeedchick]

Or you could learn to service it yourself and do the job properly.

heh heh...that's a good one.

You're right it's touchy, 'cause I took the bike in to have the wheel trued, and they threw in the hub service just to be nice! Thanks for the advice...I'll take 'er back in.