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I have a spare RR 440 rear wheel that I want to try tubeless. My understanding is I need tape, valve and sealant. This rim is 19mmm inside and 21 outside. What size.brand tape is preferred and are all valves created equal? Thanks for any help you can provide, completely ignorant about this.
 

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Banned Sock Puppet
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I have a spare RR 440 rear wheel that I want to try tubeless. My understanding is I need tape, valve and sealant. This rim is 19mmm inside and 21 outside. What size.brand tape is preferred and are all valves created equal? Thanks for any help you can provide, completely ignorant about this.
Are you sure about those dimensions? I thought it was 16mm inside, 21mm outside:

https://www.dtswiss.com/Components/Rims-Road/RR-440
 

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Russian Troll Farmer
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Correction: You need tape, valve, sealant, PATIENCE, and MONEY. And, in the end, if you keep track of the time, money, weight, etc., you will see that it's not worth it. OTOH, if you turn a blind eye to all of that, you can post sunny, upbeat posts about how great your experience has been (trust me, I've seen this happen a lot lately). You may even be able to sucker a few people in joining your folly if you make your posts sound believable enough. Let us know how it works out for you.
 

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Correction: You need tape, valve, sealant, PATIENCE, and MONEY. And, in the end, if you keep track of the time, money, weight, etc., you will see that it's not worth it. OTOH, if you turn a blind eye to all of that, you can post sunny, upbeat posts about how great your experience has been (trust me, I've seen this happen a lot lately). You may even be able to sucker a few people in joining your folly if you make your posts sound believable enough. Let us know how it works out for you.
Hmm. Cynical post. They are, after all, just tires. Cars have gone tubeless for quite a while. I changed to tubeless Hutchinson 5 tires a few weeks ago for a trial, after wearing out some Conti GatorSkins. I emailed my manufacturer, Rol, to make sure that the rim could do it. They told me it could. So, I did the whole job with the Stan's tape, sealant, valve stems, and tires for about $150 including the tires. It was fun to install them, and went well. Putting on the tape is a bit tricky. Watch some videos. Keep the tape on stretch while doing it to drop it past the lip of the rim.

My experience of about 200 miles has been great. I am running the tires with fairly low pressures of 70 front, 80 rear, 25 mm tires. I weigh 162. The tires are smooth and grip well. When I pump them up, if I pop the valve like I usually do I get a spritz of sealant. I don't like that. So, I figured out just to unscrew the valve stem, and pop on the floor pump straight away. No mess, and it works correctly.

So, with a bit of learning it is not hard. I don't know if they will perform without flats as described, but it sure seems like it. I ride crummy roads in Sonoma county, with steep ascents and descents, and these things have performed really well. It is just a tire. If you don't like it, you can just go back to tubes and leave the new tape in your rim.
 

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Banned Sock Puppet
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My experience of about 200 miles has been great. I am running the tires with fairly low pressures of 70 front, 80 rear, 25 mm tires. I weigh 162.

You really could run this way with tubes and not have any problems. Really! That is unless you hit a tooth jarring pothole. In that case, nothing will save you.
 

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Russian Troll Farmer
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Hmm. Cynical post. They are, after all, just tires. Cars have gone tubeless for quite a while. I changed to tubeless Hutchinson 5 tires a few weeks ago for a trial, after wearing out some Conti GatorSkins. I emailed my manufacturer, Rol, to make sure that the rim could do it. They told me it could. So, I did the whole job with the Stan's tape, sealant, valve stems, and tires for about $150 including the tires. It was fun to install them, and went well. Putting on the tape is a bit tricky. Watch some videos. Keep the tape on stretch while doing it to drop it past the lip of the rim.

My experience of about 200 miles has been great. I am running the tires with fairly low pressures of 70 front, 80 rear, 25 mm tires. I weigh 162. The tires are smooth and grip well. When I pump them up, if I pop the valve like I usually do I get a spritz of sealant. I don't like that. So, I figured out just to unscrew the valve stem, and pop on the floor pump straight away. No mess, and it works correctly.

So, with a bit of learning it is not hard. I don't know if they will perform without flats as described, but it sure seems like it. I ride crummy roads in Sonoma county, with steep ascents and descents, and these things have performed really well. It is just a tire. If you don't like it, you can just go back to tubes and leave the new tape in your rim.
Wow, all for 'just' $150? For that kind of money, I know a retailer online that will sell me 5 Challenge tubulars. Prep time? about 10 minutes for the glue to brush on, and let it set for 30 minutes. 2 minutes to put tires on and seat. And, I can run low pressure, just like you can. If I get a flat, I have a spare which I can change on the road in a bout 5 minutes.

Technology marches onward.......
 

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You really could run this way with tubes and not have any problems. Really! That is unless you hit a tooth jarring pothole. In that case, nothing will save you.
No doubt. I have done so for thousands of miles a year. I just thought trying tubeless would be fun. And it is.
 

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Wow, all for 'just' $150? For that kind of money, I know a retailer online that will sell me 5 Challenge tubulars. Prep time? about 10 minutes for the glue to brush on, and let it set for 30 minutes. 2 minutes to put tires on and seat. And, I can run low pressure, just like you can. If I get a flat, I have a spare which I can change on the road in a bout 5 minutes.

Technology marches onward.......
I usually pay around $50 per tire for a Continental GatorSkin foldable kevlar 25 mm. My point was that changing to tubeless was not particularly expensive in light of that. The conversion kit was about $50 for me. Since I was going to change out the tires anyway, there you go. I am running all season tires, so expect to get 5-6 thousand miles on them, rather than the 1000 miles or so I used to get on higher performance thinner softer tires.
 

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Even at $50 for a conversion, it still sounds like you're paying extra for a new headache.
So, I am subtly getting the sense you don't like tubeless tires. No problem. No need to put them on your rims. I like them so far, and perhaps there will be a headache with them if there are failures or other issues. So far it has been fun, and they have been excellent. But that is why there is choice.
 

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So, I am subtly getting the sense you don't like tubeless tires. No problem. No need to put them on your rims. I like them so far, and perhaps there will be a headache with them if there are failures or other issues. So far it has been fun, and they have been excellent. But that is why there is choice.
Choice and free will? You've clearly been duped and suckered just as I have and the majority of people who go tubeless and stick with it.

Good luck with the experimental trial run and try to keep off of Toulouse's lawn :thumbsup:
 

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Russian Troll Farmer
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FWIW, I'm a bit of a Luddite, and frankly, I've done stupider things with my own bike budget. If that's what you want to do, go ahead. But if you want to say that it's "better", justify why you think so, and expect those of us who think otherwise to add our thoughts. You say you've rode a whole 200 miles on them; looking back on the worst car I ever owned, I was pretty pleased at the 200 mile mark. By 5000 miles, my opinion had changed.

What would be helpful is if you came back after 1000 miles, 2000 mile, even 5000 miles, and let us know how it worked out; are you still happy, is it really any 'better' or 'cheaper', or did you just give up on it?

Looking back on all the "better" cycling technologies through the years, I remember the following:

1) Biopace chainrings
2) 19mm and 18mm wide tires pumped up to 150 psig
3) freewheling bottom brackets
4) the Viscount "death fork"
5) Helicomatic hubs

Each one of the above was touted as "better", yet each met a quick end, mostly for good reason. Me? I like to stick with what works. I have only recently come away from full-friction shifting, and now finally own a bike that has not only indexing, but Hyperglide cogs as well. I still do own a bike that has downtube friction shifting, and all my roadbikes have tubulars and Brooks saddles. Some things just can't really be improved upon.
 

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FWIW, I'm a bit of a Luddite, and frankly, I've done stupider things with my own bike budget. If that's what you want to do, go ahead. But if you want to say that it's "better", justify why you think so, and expect those of us who think otherwise to add our thoughts. You say you've rode a whole 200 miles on them; looking back on the worst car I ever owned, I was pretty pleased at the 200 mile mark. By 5000 miles, my opinion had changed.

What would be helpful is if you came back after 1000 miles, 2000 mile, even 5000 miles, and let us know how it worked out; are you still happy, is it really any 'better' or 'cheaper', or did you just give up on it?

Looking back on all the "better" cycling technologies through the years, I remember the following:

1) Biopace chainrings
2) 19mm and 18mm wide tires pumped up to 150 psig
3) freewheling bottom brackets
4) the Viscount "death fork"
5) Helicomatic hubs

Each one of the above was touted as "better", yet each met a quick end, mostly for good reason. Me? I like to stick with what works. I have only recently come away from full-friction shifting, and now finally own a bike that has not only indexing, but Hyperglide cogs as well. I still do own a bike that has downtube friction shifting, and all my roadbikes have tubulars and Brooks saddles. Some things just can't really be improved upon.
Of course. I am not saying they are better with 200 miles experience. Absolutely, after 5000 miles I will have an idea whether I like this technology. I have no idea if it will be better. I was not particularly unhappy with my tube tires. There are some things about it that make me feel it could be better. But, it is just a tire. I don't race or ride for high speed. I get like 100 miles in a week on a nice bike, and enjoy the exercise and the hobby. So, trying new tech for the fun of it is great. Clearly tires with tubes have stood the test of time, and have worked well for me too. So, if they don't work out for me, big deal. Have you tried them? You seem to have a very negative opinion of this technology. Now that I have set my rims up for the tubeless, if I want to run a standard tire with a tube, all I do is stick a tube in there after washing out the water soluble sealant. Don't even have to get rid of the new tape.

I am also a fan of Brooks saddles, and have a B17 on one bike, and a Swift on my faster bike.
 

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Looking back on all the "better" cycling technologies through the years, I remember the following:

1) Biopace chainrings
2) 19mm and 18mm wide tires pumped up to 150 psig
3) freewheling bottom brackets
4) the Viscount "death fork"
5) Helicomatic hubs
Tubeless road certainly has it's pros and cons and almost certainly will never become mainstream as say indexed shifting did. However, the examples you mention above are bad analogies. Tubeless road has been available for around 10 years now and, as time has gone on, more and more big name tire manufacturers are adding tubeless road models to their lines. A more appropriate analogy would be road disc brakes.

If you use older components/technology and that floats your boat then great. I don't think you'll find anybody who has tried road tubeless technology for a good length of time will say using tubeless is as magical unicorns riding rainbows. But I think many/most will say the good outweighs the bad- which like many things in life is about as much as you can hope for.
 

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Adventure Seeker
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Looking back on all the "better" cycling technologies through the years, I remember the following:

1) Biopace chainrings
2) 19mm and 18mm wide tires pumped up to 150 psig
3) freewheling bottom brackets
4) the Viscount "death fork"
5) Helicomatic hubs

Each one of the above was touted as "better", yet each met a quick end, mostly for good reason. Me? I like to stick with what works.
Buy a mountain bike and ride it for a while, I think you'll quickly change your mind. It's not a fad. Same (as stated above) for cars. Or, do you still insist on tubes on your car? About the only thing I'd really like to see change with tubeless is going away from Presta valves, because the unscrewing of the valve can leave a mess for many.
 

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Banned Sock Puppet
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Buy a mountain bike and ride it for a while, I think you'll quickly change your mind. It's not a fad. Same (as stated above) for cars. Or, do you still insist on tubes on your car? About the only thing I'd really like to see change with tubeless is going away from Presta valves, because the unscrewing of the valve can leave a mess for many.


Huh? My mountain bikes still use tubes as well as V-brakes. Mind you, I use thorn resistant tubes, but they're still tubes.
 

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My back tire is still using a tube, the front is tubeless on my MTB. hugs difference in suppleness, and grip on the trails. When I build my back wheel, it's going to be tubeless.
Now, to be fair, some of the engineers back in the day had it right. Remember 27x1.25" tires were pretty much standard? That's almost a 32mm tire, which is becoming more common for distance riders due to improved comfort.
Also, tubeless tires are getting a serious price hike because it's not fully mainstream yet. I can't justify paying $80 to $125 for a bike tire yet. Thankfully, I've seen better pricing at certain retailers.
 
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