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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So, were those, Gore, for example, who endoresed Dean courageous or misguided (to put it nicely)? Gore sought to make himself relevant again -- how's that working out for him now? Did it actually hurt Dean?

Does anyone recall some people thinking that Dean was an arrogant angry jerk, and that eventually voters would see this?

Doug
 

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When a campaign turns to

serial endorsements to give the impression of momentum, you can usually figure it's in trouble. That's been a maxim of mine since Ed Muskie lined up something like 77,000 endorsements before going down in flames, hugely, in 1972.

The Gore thing was OK, pretty good in fact, but then Dean just KEPT trotting out new people. I tried to convince myself it was all right, this was a different kind of insugency, and Dean came out of nowhere, so it was important to reassure folks with all these 'establishment' types vouching for him by endorsing him. But in retrospect, it was just politics as usual, and the maxim held. The more endorsements a candidate touts, the bigger trouble he's in.
 

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i think he'd have been better off if he avoided any of those wahington beltway connections. once he started piling them up, and began playing it safe, the general wisdom of how to run as a frontrunner, he didn't come off as the outside insurgent that he once did.

i don't think his "yeaaahhh" speech was, in reality, that bad. someone said, i'm not sure if it was on this board, that when you heard it with all the background noise of the event, it played much better. i mean, he got red-faced, but he was laughing and smiling at the end, so i don't think it was anger, but it didn't play well on tv, and the constant coverage of it didn't help any.

i think dean really went wrong when he started battling back against negative attacks with negativity of his own. i think whoever the nominee is is going to have to fight back against rove's negative attacks, and i know there's gonna be a lot of them about kerry. but they're gonna have to fight back by standing strong, refuting them on their facts, and attacking bush on his record and actions. perhaps negativity might work inb the general election, but it was a killer for the primaries.

i still feel that dean is the only one of the candidates who could withstand the negative attacks that are bound to come from rove. edwards may be able to, but kerry, with his disposition to come down on all sides of an issue, his wishy-washy pandering, is gonna fold like a cheap table unless he gets good advice on how to stand up to them.
 

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DougSloan said:
Gore sought to make himself relevant again -- how's that working out for him now?
Well, Gore is seeking to make himself relevant by broaching serious issues - the War, the environment, the election - on a serious level. He has his opinion. For the millions of people who appreciate the thoughtfullness he is capable of, that is valuable.

I don't think he give a rat's a$$ about the others (who also number in the millions) who refuse to take the issues seriously and fascinate themselves with personality politics. In that sense, people like you have won.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
whaddya know, Dean says Gore hurt him

Dean May Gain Little With Gore's Approval
21 minutes ago

By KARIN MILLER, Associated Press Writer

NASHVILLE, Tenn. - Howard Dean (news - web sites) can claim Al Gore (news - web sites)'s endorsement, but the dispiriting reality for the fallen front-runner is he may match the former vice president's 2000 showing in Tennessee — a Gore loss in his home state.

The Democratic presidential candidate is polling in single digits in advance of Tennessee's primary Tuesday and has no plans to visit, choosing to look ahead to must-win Wisconsin and its Feb. 17 primary to salvage his campaign.


"He thinks Tennessee is a long shot, and his lack of activity here has ensured that," said John Geer, a Vanderbilt University political scientist.


Gore's lack of activity may have contributed, too.


The 2000 Democratic presidential nominee has flown as far away as Iowa and Michigan to campaign for Dean, but has barely lifted a finger in the state that launched his political career, and where he teaches and maintains a home and a farm. He also has not helped Dean raise campaign money here.


The primary race is competitive with John Edwards (news - web sites) and Wesley Clark (news - web sites) looking to slow front-runner John Kerry (news - web sites).


Gore will attend a Democratic fund-raiser Sunday in Nashville, but it's for the state party — not for Dean — and Gore is one of three former officeholders being honored.


Most former Gore supporters are working for rival campaigns, with the notable exception being Roy Neel, who recently accepted the job of trying to right Dean's campaign ship.


Gore could not be reached for comment, and his aides declined to answer questions about the impact of his Dean endorsement in early December on the campaign.


Gore remains a popular standard-bearer for some Tennessee Democrats, but he has frustrated the more conservative arm of the party. As he took to the national stage in the 1990s after representing Tennessee in House and Senate for 16 years, his stance on issues such as abortion and gun control became increasingly liberal.


Four years ago, Gore lost Tennessee to Republican George W. Bush, 51 percent to 47 percent, and the state continues its tilt to the right.


"You lose contact with the public and you can give all the endorsements you want, but you become a voice in a hollow tree," said Democrat Tommy Burnett, a former lawmaker and lobbyist.


Allison Shaw, who was casting her ballot for Wesley Clark on the last day of Tennessee's early voting period Thursday, said Gore's endorsement hurts Dean in Tennessee.


"A lot of people see Al Gore as ... out there, not in touch with most Tennesseans."


But Deb McCarver, a spokeswoman for the Dean campaign in Tennessee, argued that Gore's backing could help Dean, particularly among black Tennesseeans.


"We've done things in African-American neighborhoods in Nashville where a lot of people have told us, 'If Gore's for him, we're for him,'" she said.


Several Democrats have argued that the embrace from party establishment figures such as Gore, former President Carter and Bill Bradley (news - web sites) undercut Dean's attempt to portray himself as a Washington outsider.

Even Dean has suggested that Gore's endorsement may have doomed him. Asked whether Gore's backing marked the decline of his campaign, Dean concurred.

"I actually do think the endorsement of Al Gore began the decline, not for the reason that you said, because the establishment in Washington really realized that I might be the nominee and they did not like that," Dean told CNN on Tuesday night. "The media folks didn't like it, the other folks in the race didn't like it, and they did everything they could to make sure we weren't" the nominee.

Burnett said "the real problem is that Dean has some sort of twist to his personality that warms you up and then alienates you. That's his problem, not Gore's."

Some analysts think Dean's poor showing in spite of Gore's endorsement could damage any future political aspirations the former vice president might have, but Geer said Gore remains a political force.

"It would be better if Dean won," Geer said, "but the reality is that Gore still has a lot of clout in the party and he has reminded people he's still a player."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040206/ap_on_el_pr/dean_gore&cid=694&ncid=2043
 

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Dean and Gore are history

Both are old time "good guy" democrats. Clark may be on the ball, but he's no politician. The only one left who knows how to fight dirty is Kerry. He showed that he had brains when he disagreed with the gay marrige court decision.
 

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But not among voters, among political bosses and the media, both of whom feel entitled to pick the candidates (and the eventual winners).
 
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