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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was at the Montreal bike show and just rode on side by side bikes with regular Dura Ace 7900 and Di2. I was on each bike for a few minutes. It only takes 10 seconds and a few shifts to sense the difference and feel what the future of components will be. The difference is not incremental - the speed and accuracy of the electronic shifting is a different paradigm altogether.

Of course no one needs it, it costs to much etc... and it will make believers of all the naysayers and soon become the norm to which everyone aspires.
 

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lawr said:
I was at the Montreal bike show and just rode on side by side bikes with regular Dura Ace 7900 and Di2. I was on each bike for a few minutes. It only takes 10 seconds and a few shifts to sense the difference and feel what the future of components will be. The difference is not incremental - the speed and accuracy of the electronic shifting is a different paradigm altogether.

Of course no one needs it, it costs to much etc... and it will make believers of all the naysayers and soon become the norm to which everyone aspires.
I'd say your cable-shifting systems you've used need(ed) a tune-up.
 

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at the risk of starting the flame war (please dont, I am just stating my opinions). Perhaps I am getting too old and too conservative but I think this invention is rubbish.

I am prepared to accept that is shifts gears better/faster. That is not the point.

I think the whole concept is flawed. The purity of cycling as green sport and green transport is ruined by this invention. The whole idea of powering a bicycle as a 100% human endevour is betrayed. I will never buy such as thing even if the price is same as a purely human-powered mechanical gears. This invention misses the whole point of moving a bicycle. It is not an electric car. All propulsion, including all gears, must be done by the cyclist, not a battery. The sooner this is banned from the sport the better. What next? Electric engines to help cyclist climb better?

I am excluding power-meters and cycling computers here because those are not involved in moving a bicycle i.e. bicycle would function same with or without cycle-computer or lights or power-meter. But gears are part of movement, no electricity please.

off the soap box.
 

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and...

acid_rider said:
at the risk of starting the flame war (please dont, I am just stating my opinions). Perhaps I am getting too old and too conservative but I think this invention is rubbish.

I am prepared to accept that is shifts gears better/faster. That is not the point.

I think the whole concept is flawed. The purity of cycling as green sport and green transport is ruined by this invention. The whole idea of powering a bicycle as a 100% human endevour is betrayed. I will never buy such as thing even if the price is same as a purely human-powered mechanical gears. This invention misses the whole point of moving a bicycle. It is not an electric car. All propulsion, including all gears, must be done by the cyclist, not a battery. The sooner this is banned from the sport the better. What next? Electric engines to help cyclist climb better?

I am excluding power-meters and cycling computers here because those are not involved in moving a bicycle i.e. bicycle would function same with or without cycle-computer or lights or power-meter. But gears are part of movement, no electricity please.

off the soap box.
Luddite....

(I couldn't resist)
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
To 1201 - The point was that the two dura ace systems were side by side - maintained by Shimano at their booth.

To Acid rider - I'm quite happy the bicycle has evolved from a wooden structure without pedals that needed the rider to push down on the ground to propel it. The manufacturing process of the sport alone makes it not as green as you would like to make it seem. This is just another inevitable step in the process of mechanization which doesn't detract from the basic principle - that it takes a wonderful effort to propel yourself on a sophisticated device for as long a distance as you desire. Go try the electric shifting and then see how you feel. To me it was less clunky and oddly less intrusive - strangely more silent - something I appreciate while I ride.
 

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lawr said:
To 1201 - The point was that the two dura ace systems were side by side - maintained by Shimano at their booth.

To Acid rider - I'm quite happy the bicycle has evolved from a wooden structure without pedals that needed the rider to push down on the ground to propel it. The manufacturing process of the sport alone makes it not as green as you would like to make it seem. This is just another inevitable step in the process of mechanization which doesn't detract from the basic principle - that it takes a wonderful effort to propel yourself on a sophisticated device for as long a distance as you desire. Go try the electric shifting and then see how you feel. To me it was less clunky and oddly less intrusive - strangely more silent - something I appreciate while I ride.
anit-luddite
 

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lawr said:
To 1201 - The point was that the two dura ace systems were side by side - maintained by Shimano at their booth.

It is a good thing Shimano doesn't have a vested interest in selling the most ridiculous and overpriced toys of their line....
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Room 1201 said:
It is a good thing Shimano doesn't have a vested interest in selling the most ridiculous and overpriced toys of their line....
Yes, I see your point - they must have sabotaged their previously top product to make their newer one look better.

But then again you could just try it and see for yourself.
 

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The purity of cycling as green sport and green transport is ruined by this invention.
Right because rubber and metal(s) and clear coat and plastic and the process used to make these things are "green"...?

This does make sense however...

The whole idea of powering a bicycle as a 100% human endevour
...and I agree, but I think that if we always balk at "progress" or "outside the box thinking", then we'd be still back here...

I'm quite happy the bicycle has evolved from a wooden structure without pedals that needed the rider to push down on the ground to propel it
Thanks for the review Lawr. What a neat opportunity.
 

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Room 1201 said:
It is a good thing Shimano doesn't have a vested interest in selling the most ridiculous and overpriced toys of their line....
I expect they detuned their 7900 stuff in order to sell electric! After all nobody would notice and nobody would decide to avoid both and go to Red instead.

These conspiracies just keep on coming--don't they. Good that we have the brilliant minds here on the forum to expose these bastards!
 

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I rode it last weekend. My LBS has a Colnago CX-1 outfitted with the Di2. It was a nice ride. Though it feels... ummm... measured. Each shift shifts at about the same time. It is a strange feeling. I didn't see anything that made it "all that".
 

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SwiftSolo said:
I expect they detuned their 7900 stuff in order to sell electric! After all nobody would notice and nobody would decide to avoid both and go to Red instead.

These conspiracies just keep on coming--don't they. Good that we have the brilliant minds here on the forum to expose these bastards!
If I were Shimano I'd do all I could to try to sell it. Hell, they introduced the most overpriced and over-the-top unnecessary cycling product at a time of worldwide economic downturn. Could their timing for trying to sell Di2 have been any worse?
 

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The inconvience of having to remember to recharge a battery pack will make this product unrealistic for the vast majority of road cyclists, competitive or recreational.

The thought of arriving at a race with a dead battery is enough to turn me off to the concept no matter how well it shifts.
 

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funktekk said:
The inconvience of having to remember to recharge a battery pack will make this product unrealistic for the vast majority of road cyclists, competitive or recreational.

The thought of arriving at a race with a dead battery is enough to turn me off to the concept no matter how well it shifts.
Remember those old generators that you snapped up to ride on the side of the tire? I think that's just the thing to cover your concerns. I'm going to the Seattle swap meet this morning and look for some.
does anybody know what size batteries the Di takes? I'm curious now about how much power these consume.
 

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martinrjensen said:
Remember those old generators that you snapped up to ride on the side of the tire? I think that's just the thing to cover your concerns. I'm going to the Seattle swap meet this morning and look for some.
does anybody know what size batteries the Di takes? I'm curious now about how much power these consume.
A proprietary Li-Ion, as I recall, that of course-only Shimano sells....usually rechargeables only have a 100-200 cycle lifetime before their charge capacity drops like a stone.
 

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I'd imagine that batteries will come out to replace the DA one, or they will be relatively easy to hack.

I think that being able to shift under load is a great advantage. I don't really get the whole human-powered argument - were you really getting a ton of exercise out of pushing that tiny little lever around? Plus, I think my wife would just love smaller STI shifters.

Plus I suspect that time trialers will love both being able to shift while at full power and the loss of air turbulence by cables.

The eco-argument I totally get on the other hand. Most race bikes aren't really produced in an eco-conscious manner (CF and Ti both are pretty horrible from that perspective) and adding batteries and "disposable" electronics isn't going to make that better.
 
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