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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know most small frame builders all the way to the big ones are having their carbon parts and frames being made in Taiwan. Most of the companies are using the same companies in Taiwan to make the parts. It seems like anyone can buy a frame or part and put their companies name on it. Do you think most of the quality they are turning out are high quality? I’m sure some have stricter guidelines when making parts than others. I have just been seeing allot of frames and parts on web site and eBay that you have never heard of before that look the same as big name companies parts for half the price.
 

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Yes, I think the Taiwanese bicycle products are excellent. I also think the move there with manufacturing has made brand differences pretty meaningless. Yes, you can buy a no-name frame that is as good as a name frame for a lot less money.
 

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When you outsource your frame building you're not really a frame builder anymore, but a designer. Brand names or rather the designs behind them haven't become meaningless. There's still a large quality and performance spread amongst different brands.....it's just like giving a random guy and a sushi chef a blowfish to prepare...the first will probably end up killing his customers, whilst the other prepares a good meal.
 

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divve said:
When you outsource your frame building you're not really a frame builder anymore, but a designer. Brand names or rather the designs behind them haven't become meaningless. There's still a large quality and performance spread amongst different brands.....it's just like giving a random guy and a sushi chef a blowfish to prepare...the first will probably end up killing his customers, whilst the other prepares a good meal.
Large quality and performance spread? Hardly. Barely perceptible, maybe. The sushi chef thing isn't even an analogy. It has nothing to do with anything related to bicycles. Sorry, I just don't buy this, despite people's strong desire to cling to the magic of the names emblazoned on their down tubes.
 

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Yes, it makes a difference

I am not saying that todays frames coming out of Taiwan are bad frames. Taiwan, on average knows carbon fiber better than most countries, and bikes today are better than ever, and there are great deals to be had. BUT, there is a difference. I have seen CF frames with little balls of carbon or whatever rolling around inside of the top tube (from Taiwan) and I have seen CF frames warped and misaligned (from Taiwan). I have ridden frames from Taiwan, and agree that they can be quite good. I have also ridden some of the cookie cutter CF frames from Taiwan and felt that they were so uncomfortable that you should save money and buy an aluminum frame instead. In the end, you get what you pay for, and, you don't get what you don't pay for.
 

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There are quite a number of small manufacturers that still make carbon fiber frames in the States. Craig Calfee is one, for example, who has been doing so for many years. I suspect most people who have gotten Tawianese frames didn't even know it because the names on the downtubes are known brands. Even Colnago has some of their frames made in Taiwan, now. The reason is obvious; cost of manufacture; manufacturing has gone to the Pacific rim because it's cheaper there. Competition is so great, though, that you do not find much in the way of poor quality except in the deep-discount third-tier bike brands. They are no better than any department store bike, when it gets down to it.

When it gets down to it, though, most people are not riding the frame, rather, they are riding wheels, bars, stems, seats and drivetrains that are for the most part, Japanese.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I think 80% of carbon frames are from Taiwan. As for parts like 95% are from Taiwan. Bike Companies just give them a design and they fab it up and the worst case they pick a stock design and slap their name on it. Majority of these companies just get raw carbon frames shipped to them and they paint them in house and slap on logos.
 

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US made carbon frames

the only 2 manufacturers that still make frames domestically (in the US) are calfee and ........TREK. all TREK OCLV bikes are made by hame in wisconsin..I suggest anyone who thinks carbon Calnogo's are made in Italy,carbon Ridley's are made in Belgium, or your favorite brand A are made in their respective home country send an email to that manufacturer and ask for yourself.........most are made in one of 3 overseas factories.....
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Do you know what companies make most carbon frames overseas? I have heard the same their is only a few high end companies that make all carbon frames.
 

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3465mike said:
the only 2 manufacturers that still make frames domestically (in the US) are calfee and ........TREK. all TREK OCLV bikes are made by hame in wisconsin..I suggest anyone who thinks carbon Calnogo's are made in Italy,carbon Ridley's are made in Belgium, or your favorite brand A are made in their respective home country send an email to that manufacturer and ask for yourself.........most are made in one of 3 overseas factories.....
Colnago carbon frames are NOT made in Taiwan, some of their entry level aluminum bikes are, but that is all.
 

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promtber said:
Do you know what companies make most carbon frames overseas? I have heard the same their is only a few high end companies that make all carbon frames.
I don't have the names of the actually carbon manufacturing factories in Tawain and China, however I can tell you that most except for those previously stated are made their...there are some exceptions I'm sure that I'm unaware of....and example is that carbon LOOK forks are made in france, but their frames are made in Asia.....but a list of definite Asian manufactured brands are: Specialized, Cannondale's Synapse, KHS, FUJI, Jamis, GIANT (gian may actually be on of the better asian carbon bikes as they even make their own carbon fibers) Calnago, LOOK, Ridley, etc..........
 

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fmw said:
Large quality and performance spread? Hardly. Barely perceptible, maybe. The sushi chef thing isn't even an analogy. It has nothing to do with anything related to bicycles. Sorry, I just don't buy this, despite people's strong desire to cling to the magic of the names emblazoned on their down tubes.
I suggest you take a Felt F1C for a test ride and then a Cervelo R3. There's a huge difference in torsional stiffness between the two. The same goes for lightweight forks. Some are so flexible they're simply unsuitable to race with.
 

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divve said:
When you outsource your frame building you're not really a frame builder anymore, but a designer. Brand names or rather the designs behind them haven't become meaningless. There's still a large quality and performance spread amongst different brands.....it's just like giving a random guy and a sushi chef a blowfish to prepare...the first will probably end up killing his customers, whilst the other prepares a good meal.

Yes, well stated though I think I'd substitute significant in place of large.
 

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fmw said:
Large quality and performance spread? Hardly. Barely perceptible, maybe. The sushi chef thing isn't even an analogy. It has nothing to do with anything related to bicycles. Sorry, I just don't buy this, despite people's strong desire to cling to the magic of the names emblazoned on their down tubes.
Not "large" nor "barely perceptible" either. I'm sure we all agree that it's not about the names; it's about the choice of materials, use of the materials, the production methods and quality control.
 

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False

3465mike said:
the only 2 manufacturers that still make frames domestically (in the US) are calfee and ........TREK. all TREK OCLV bikes are made by hame in wisconsin..I suggest anyone who thinks carbon Calnogo's are made in Italy,carbon Ridley's are made in Belgium, or your favorite brand A are made in their respective home country send an email to that manufacturer and ask for yourself.........most are made in one of 3 overseas factories.....

Parlee frames are manufactured in the US, carbon Colnago frames are manufactured in Italy, carbon Fondriest frames are also manufactured in Italy and Time frames are manufactured in France. Them's the facts and if you don't believe me perhaps you should email those companies and provide the proof of your original assertion yourself.

P.S. It's Colnago, not Calnogo and yes Ridley's are made in Asia, not Belgium.

Oh... and the Mizuno forks that Fondriest uses are also made in Asia.
 

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promtber said:

http://www.bicycleretailer.com/bicy...t_id=1001000848

Retraction: Colnago Not Sourcing Carbon Frames from Giant

AUGUST 01, 2005 -- CAMBIAGO, Italy (BRAIN)—Reports that Colnago of Italy is sourcing full carbon frames from Giant Manufacturing in Taiwan are erroneous, say the presidents of both companies.

“For the 2006 model year, Colnago will be sourcing two entry-level aluminum road bike models from Giant, made to Colnago's spec and frame geometry and for sales in Europe and Asia only. All other Colnago bicycles are made in Italy. No Colnago carbon fiber frames are made at Giant and none will be, as Mr. Colnago has a long-term sourcing agreement in place with ATR for carbon fiber bicycle frames,” Ernesto Colnago, founder and president of Colnago, said through an interpreter.

ATR Group is also the composites supplier to Italian racecar maker Ferrari.

Jeffrey Sheu, special assistant and spokesman for Giant president Tony Lo, wrote: “Mr. Ernesto Colnago's statement on July 28, 2005 responding to reports (that Colnago sources carbon frames from Giant) is correct. The CENS report on July 27, 2005 is not correct.”

Sheu was referring to a report by China Economic News Service (CENS) that the Italian and Taiwanese companies had a contract under which Giant would begin producing carbon frames for Colnago this fall. The news service quoted Hsu Li-chun, special assistant at Giant's administration department, as its source.

Last week Bicycle Retailer and Industry News called Giant USA on the matter and a spokesperson confirmed the CENS report, at which point Bicycle Retailer published it on this site.

We regret the error and any confusion it may have caused.
 
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