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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Sam is a really good guy, ( and a FAST guy!!)



Finally starting to get some recognition.
 

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Jerkhard Sirdribbledick
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27,036 Posts
terry b said:
Best CF goes to Independent Fab? :confused:

I guess they got tired of giving it to Nic.
And from the pictures I saw here (close-ups only, I think) it was butt-ugly.
 

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eminence grease
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18,538 Posts
DrRoebuck said:
And from the pictures I saw here (close-ups only, I think) it was butt-ugly.
I think the voters must have liked the little crowny luggy things.

I have the utmost respect for IF (I loves your bike) but it really bugs me when builders who set a standard for excellence in the materials they offer head in the CF direction for what appears to be marketing reasons. Yes, I know they want to stay in business and yes, I know it might make good business sense and yes, I know it's none of my business and no one cares what I think, but - it just feels really cheesy to me.

Ah well.
 

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Jerkhard Sirdribbledick
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27,036 Posts
terry b said:
I have the utmost respect for IF (I loves your bike) but it really bugs me when builders who set a standard for excellence in the materials they offer head in the CF direction for what appears to be marketing reasons. Yes, I know they want to stay in business and yes, I know it might make good business sense and yes, I know it's none of my business and no one cares what I think, but - it just feels really cheesy to me.
And I think it stands to reason that we're drawn to these builders because they specialize in a particular material, etc., and it also stands to reason that the more they branch out the less they will specialize.

IF seems to be caught in the middle between a decent sized bike company and the hardcore frame builders. I loves my bike, too, but I didn't really talk to anyone from IF to get it done. It all went through the LBS.
 

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"El Bwana"
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4,399 Posts
Nice to see Mark Nobilette get some props.
 

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a jumped up pantry boy
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1,784 Posts
surprised to see vanilla get shut out.
 

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More cowbell!
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2,527 Posts
ditto. I get a stiffy every time I think of the Speedvagen track bike's headtube cutout logo with the carbon behind it.
 

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Beetpull DeLite
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12,756 Posts
yarble said:
surprised to see vanilla get shut out.
I'm not...Sacha's bikes were nice but not top-level efforts like many of the other builders. I was underwhelmed. Not saying they weren't nice but in company like that it's easy not to stand out.
 

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eminence grease
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18,538 Posts
GirchyGirchy said:
I'm not...Sacha's bikes were nice but not top-level efforts like many of the other builders. I was underwhelmed. Not saying they weren't nice but in company like that it's easy not to stand out.
I think his direction is getting dull. And Speedvagen IMHO is an interesting play on marketing - highly priced plain bikes "blessed" because of the brand that backs them up. He'd be the last to admit it, but he's a marketing genius. I wonder how much the Speedvagen branded Wellies were?
 

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Beetpull DeLite
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12,756 Posts
terry b said:
I think his direction is getting dull. And Speedvagen IMHO is an interesting play on marketing - highly priced plain bikes "blessed" because of the brand that backs them up. He'd be the last to admit it, but he's a marketing genius. I wonder how much the Speedvagen branded Wellies were?
The Speedvagens were interesting and had some nice details and great craftsmanship, but I'd rate them dull. Just not my thing.

T-shirts were $25. I didn't ask how much the brass knuckles were. :rolleyes:
 

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eminence grease
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18,538 Posts
GirchyGirchy said:
The Speedvagens were interesting and had some nice details and great craftsmanship, but I'd rate them dull. Just not my thing.

T-shirts were $25. I didn't ask how much the brass knuckles were. :rolleyes:
He and I had a big blow out on bikeforums.net a year or so ago about branding. My position was that he had done a fantastic job of building his brand and that it was now a cascade - people wanted his product not only because it was good, but because of what it represented to the buyer, and to anyone that might see it. It's what luxe brands are all about. He didn't like that notion, preferring to think that it was all about aesthetics and relationships.

I think Speedvagen is a great example of what I am talking about - a "workshop" bike in one color that to an average consumer's eyes looks extremely unspecial. Couple that with a limited production run balanced against a 6 year waiting list for his "A" brand and people will flock. Which of course they did. Even if I was the best TIG welder in North America and as much of a sweetheart as TMB, my limited run of generically painted TIG steel bikes wouldn't sell out in 100 weeks, let alone one. Internet forums serve to simply stoke the fire in a most self-congratulatory fashion. It's brand Hoardom and none of us are above it.

Other builders have it too, check around the net where people are calling Pegoretti's furry seated paint experiment "best in show." I mean, c'mon. I know we all have differing tastes, but really.

Having looked at the Vanilla-Speedvagen booth though took even the most cynical me back. T-shirts - sure. But branded Wellies? I bet it would take me 200 years to sell my stock of terry b branded Wellies. You'd buy a pair though, right?
 

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Beetpull DeLite
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12,756 Posts
terry b said:
Other builders have it too, check around the net where people are calling Pegoretti's furry seated paint experiment "best in show." I mean, c'mon. I know we all have differing tastes, but really.
That thing was hideous. I'm guessing it was high hipster-doofus quotient who liked it.


Having looked at the Vanilla-Speedvagen booth though took even the most cynical me back. T-shirts - sure. But branded Wellies? I bet it would take me 200 years to sell my stock of terry b branded Wellies. You'd buy a pair though, right?
Yes.
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
The Speedvagen to me is kind of like buying a Tom Clancy book that wasn't written by Tom Clancy.

What's the point?


( apart from the fact that they are dull, unimaginative and cynical )
 
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