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dagger said:
If I was a professional cyclist I would be pissed if newspapers and organizations could accuse me of doping without proof. This crap is getting out of hand and the cyclists need to just all go on strike. Screw the ASO, Le Equipe, and El Pais for just making a freak show out of this.
Yes, how dare they do anything to clean up the sport that dosen't meet with your approval. Personally I'd like to see them go to a one time, lifetime ban, you get caught you never race again, I think they should do anything to protect the sport from this crap. It's pretty obvious that doping is very wide spread, and while I would like almost nothing more than to see Jan win this years tour, the one thing I would like more is the ability to atleast believe that some rider is clean, which is currently not the case. So Vino dosen't ride the tour this year, it's not a life changing deal, does it suck, yup, but you know what, life sucks sometimes.
 

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That would be similar to baseball players boycotting the World Series or football players playing hookey from the Superbowl.

However, I do wish law enforcement and the media would treat MLB, NFL, and NBA in the same fashion. There a few people there that could use a two year ban.
 

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offer a 1 year ban

if they 'come clean' and lifetime if they don't and are found guilty

looks like we may wind up with an all American Podium. Wouldn't that be a funny way to start a post LA TdF.

all I know is LA has to be laughing his a$$ off right about now
 

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atpjunkie said:
1 year ban if they 'come clean' and lifetime if they don't and are found guilty/QUOTE]

Better yet, if they're found guilty, 10 members of opposing teams would be given free reign to beat the guily one with broken spokes and used inner tubes! :mad2:
 

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I wouldn't say there is no proof, after all weren't there like 200 bags of blood? If a rider wants to prove their innocence, then provide a sample. I wonder if the UCI would be able to provide a sample on their behalf...it's not like these folks haven't given blood before.
 

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Einstruzende said:
I wouldn't say there is no proof, after all weren't there like 200 bags of blood? If a rider wants to prove their innocence, then provide a sample. I wonder if the UCI would be able to provide a sample on their behalf...it's not like these folks haven't given blood before.

Actually all they need is a single strand of hair.
 

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dagger said:
If I was a professional cyclist I would be pissed if newspapers and organizations could accuse me of doping without proof. This crap is getting out of hand and the cyclists need to just all go on strike. Screw the ASO, Le Equipe, and El Pais for just making a freak show out of this.
No newspaper is making anything up. There have been leaks, speculation, but tomorrow morning the full list will arrive, from dna matched blood. Then they will be branded as cheats and forever remembered in the biggest doping scandal in sports history.

I wish they would involuntarily boycott cycling forever, ie: lifetime bans as others suggest,

SIlas
 

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You are half right and Lance is no doubt getting a good laugh. Too bad he isn't in shape, he could win 8 in a cake walk now(barring illness, injury or bike trouble).

I know guys are on all types of stuff. I use to race BMX in my teens, and I saw guys shoot up at the World Championships. Did UCI officials say a word? NO.

Lance may/maynot (your opinion their) of used EPO in 1999. But, it was semi-legal seeing no test could catch it. Then they thaw urine in 05 and say he used it. 1 sample, no cross match and he was "guilty to atleast the French".

Now we have a ton of guys, and most are looking VERY guilty. So, what do you do?

1- Test them everyday all year? Could work, or atleast say every 2 weeks.

2- Let them ride and who cares.

3- Ban users and hope the races are still exciting and not just gruleing grind out pedal strokes.

I feel they nailed Lance to make him look bad, US has alot of TV viewers and tourists making alot of money during the TDF in France. Pull Lance in for ANOTHER race...more $$$. But, I think atleast 50% of the guys now ARE guilty.

It should make the race more fair...could BIG GEORGE win now? Alot better odds now than last week.

Last, you need more than 1 strand of hair whoever said that. DNA in hair is fine. BUT, as it grows the chemical grows out with it. So, in say 2 months...it normaly is gone. Seen many long haired pro cyclists lately? SMART move to avoid hair tytpe tests.
 

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Suggesting that riders should boycott is the lamest thing I've ever heard. The logic in that is like saying, "You caught my friend cheating, now I'm going to boycott because you caught them." WHAT?!? That makes no sense. Quite frankly, the rest of the TdF field should be glad the dopers are out of the race. They give cycling a bad name and hurt the sport. I'm disappointed that Ullrich and Basso are part of this and won't race, but axing them and everybody else is/was the right thing to do. It shows that cycling is serious about cleaning up the sport. The rest of the pro peloton should be thankful and the other dopers out there should put down the syringe.
 

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reporterkyle said:
The logic in that is like saying, "You caught my friend cheating, now I'm going to boycott because you caught them." WHAT?!? That makes no sense.
Actually, the logic appears to be more like "someone alleged that my friend cheated, so you failed him"
reporterkyle said:
Quite frankly, the rest of the TdF field should be glad the dopers are out of the race.
I believe what you meant is "some dopers are out of the race". What we have now is a field not involved with Fuentes
reporterkyle said:
I'm disappointed that Ullrich and Basso are part of this and won't race, but axing them and everybody else is/was the right thing to do
The right thing to do is to axe anyone who is suspected?
reporterkyle said:
The rest of the pro peloton should be thankful
or, perhaps, worried
 

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You are also half right. Lance is getting a good laugh - cause he cheated the system the same as these guys over his last 7 wins. He had this cheating system down pat. He's got his own doctor who is on the hush hush. He doesn't have to goto Spain to get his blood taken care of.




Shelby1004 said:
You are half right and Lance is no doubt getting a good laugh. Too bad he isn't in shape, he could win 8 in a cake walk now(barring illness, injury or bike trouble).

I know guys are on all types of stuff. I use to race BMX in my teens, and I saw guys shoot up at the World Championships. Did UCI officials say a word? NO.

Lance may/maynot (your opinion their) of used EPO in 1999. But, it was semi-legal seeing no test could catch it. Then they thaw urine in 05 and say he used it. 1 sample, no cross match and he was "guilty to atleast the French".

Now we have a ton of guys, and most are looking VERY guilty. So, what do you do?

1- Test them everyday all year? Could work, or atleast say every 2 weeks.

2- Let them ride and who cares.

3- Ban users and hope the races are still exciting and not just gruleing grind out pedal strokes.

I feel they nailed Lance to make him look bad, US has alot of TV viewers and tourists making alot of money during the TDF in France. Pull Lance in for ANOTHER race...more $$$. But, I think atleast 50% of the guys now ARE guilty.

It should make the race more fair...could BIG GEORGE win now? Alot better odds now than last week.

Last, you need more than 1 strand of hair whoever said that. DNA in hair is fine. BUT, as it grows the chemical grows out with it. So, in say 2 months...it normaly is gone. Seen many long haired pro cyclists lately? SMART move to avoid hair tytpe tests.
 

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I would disagree with the boycott, although the tour is MOSTLY ruined, it's not TOTALLY ruined yet.

But I do agree the riders should be pissed. Unless I misunderstand, these are ACCUSATIONS only, no proof. These riders do drug tests all the time. Let them do normal doping control and let them race. If they are proven to be users later...THEN punish them. Does Europe not share our thoughts on innocent until proven guilty?

To be perfectly honest, I don't give a flying f... who takes what. I just want to see them race. I also want to see cycling grow in popularity because every new fan in the US makes me a little safer on the road. I do not understand why the powers that be in cycling are trying so hard to cut their own throats.
 

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So, am I to believe that all of these suspensions are based on hearsay? No real evidence? That is a bit disturbing in itself. On a better note, things are looking up for Team Discovery now and Hincapie. Looks like the americans riders can actually take the entire podium, wouldnt that piss off the french? Really though, 2 days before the start of the tour, publicity stunt? Oh well I will still watch and look for an american sweep.:idea: Another year of history being made at the tour. Unfortunately, the focus will be on the scandal and not the race itself.

Sean
 

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In my view other riders should be pissed at those who cheated or at least weren't discrete enough to not get caught. TDF organizers are doing the right thing under the circumstances to protect the broader interests of the event and the sport. The rules are very clear and one hopes or at least wishes that our sports heroes still have some sense of ethics and honor.

Can you imagine the discussions taking place today in the corporate board rooms of the affected sponsors?
 

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Well, what they have is somewhere between ACCUSATIONS and total proof. Look at the T-Mobile statements related to excluding Ullrich and Sevilla-- we believed their earlier denials, even got it in writing, but we've received a copy of the Guardia Civil's investigation and the evidence is overwhelming that they were working with Fuentes.... No one here has seen the files developed by the Guardia Civil, but we do know they've been matching blood bags to blood samples....

A boycott would be devastating to the sport at this point, because it would destroy whatever rider credibility there is, not only with the public, but with sponsors. Without sponsors there is no pro cycling-- and they must be made to feel confident that their riders are on the up and up (regardless of whether they are!). A boycott says, we're standing in solidarity with the oh so obviously doomed dopers of the Fuentes affair. That's a serious problem. Nuanced positions just won't fly in the charged atmosphere in which we find ourselves.

BUT, if the French police start raiding hotels and keeping riders from dinner and sleep-- then, yes, STRIKE.
 

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Pro Tour teams agreed to a code of ethics that supersedes claims of guilt or innocence. The reasonable appearance of impropriety is enough for suspension. It is the system that both the teams and the riders agreed to, so a boycott would be ridiculous.
 

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percy said:
Can you imagine the discussions taking place today in the corporate board rooms of the affected sponsors?
Yeah... They want to know if people are still watching and whether it's still on TV, internet, radio and newspapers. Until that stops happening the money will come. It may slow down a bit and cause a recession in the sport for a year or two but that's about it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I retract my statement in light of the developments

Now that there is "official" documentation the questioned riders should not ride. I just didn't like the fact that they were being proclaimed guilty in the media without official word
 
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