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gizzard said:
I wonder what he's getting from Shimano for this little sales pitch? Pretty comprehensive though.
i saw your post then saw the video and was like wow... seemed almost scripted? i mean i get that you love it.. but wow... how much more you gotta sell it.. and all this of course is coming from COMPETITIVE CYCLIST... the premiere website to get your 7900.....

:thumbsup:

and not to take away from shimano dura ace.. i too am excited. i do see where they try to improve... and what i love most are the numbers.. always give me the numbers.. 20% FASTER! 50% MORE POWER! 33% MORE STOPPAGE! 26% MORE COOL! :D

all that review and nothing in the price tho huh? not even a little guesstimate?
 

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I just liked seeing the parts as they were moved around. I think the new finish looks nice... But then again objective reviews of gruppos are never really done...

I'd love to see a review of the gruppos on a rider generating 350+ watts, shifting under heavy load, cross-chaining, and basically trying to tear apart each group. Measure shifting times from actuation, take a noise meter along, slow-motion shots of the shifts to see how "rough" they are, putting them on a machine that does nothing but generate 500W of force and see how the chain wears, another machine that just shifts the shifters a million times to failure, measure power at the crank and power at the wheel to examine drive-train efficiency (should be good, but who knows?), etc.

But that would end all the fun debates and where would be the fun in that?
 

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If you click on the kit configurator, an 8pc set will set you back $2600. Way outside of what I'd pay. My Record Groups were $1549 when I bought them, and my current DuraAce group was $1049. NO WAY i'm paying a thousand more than the previous high end.
 

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akatsuki said:
I'd love to see a review of the gruppos on a rider generating 350+ watts, shifting under heavy load, cross-chaining, and basically trying to tear apart each group. Measure shifting times from actuation, take a noise meter along, slow-motion shots of the shifts to see how "rough" they are, putting them on a machine that does nothing but generate 500W of force and see how the chain wears, another machine that just shifts the shifters a million times to failure, measure power at the crank and power at the wheel to examine drive-train efficiency (should be good, but who knows?), etc.

But that would end all the fun debates and where would be the fun in that?
Most of those tests would not really be relevant to consumers unless they plan to abuse their bikes in the same way.

I can just imagine hearing over and over again how X brand's Y group was the weakest/strongest/etc. based on these rigorous, objective tests. :rolleyes:
 

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PeanutButterBreath said:
Most of those tests would not really be relevant to consumers unless they plan to abuse their bikes in the same way.

I can just imagine hearing over and over again how X brand's Y group was the weakest/strongest/etc. based on these rigorous, objective tests. :rolleyes:
Maybe, but then again, we would all be riding 105 or something then.... And it is better hearing about how Campy is rebuildable but Shimano has a better crank and brakes etc...
 

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akatsuki said:
Maybe, but then again, we would all be riding 105 or something then.... And it is better hearing about how Campy is rebuildable but Shimano has a better crank and brakes etc...

I THINK its very important to put these groupos to torture tests... i mean they do it with cars right? i have a suv.. and i dont think i ever let it even drive over a patch of grass... let alone climb over some boulders and dig thru mudd as tested...

but i still rather know it was very capable of such... :p:idea: :cryin: :D
 

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The same calculator for the 7800 comes out at $1788. By that standard you pay an $812 premium (45%) and you save about .42 lbs on bike weight and get a barely perceptible improvement in fit and performance

You don't really need it anyway so why not, if you can afford it, indulge.
 

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I'm guessing that with a price increase like that for Dura-Ace, your going to see more high end bikes come with Ultegra when the 6700 series comes out next year. With the general overall increases across the board (my LBS told me 10 to 20% increase across the board), that Cervelo R3 I was coveting would be $7000 instead of $5000 with the new Dura-Ace. Hate to see what the Cervelo R3 SL would go for. At some point, is a 25% improvement on excellent shifting enough to justify a $1000 increase?
 

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Most of those tests would not really be relevant to consumers unless they plan to abuse their bikes in the same way.
But seeing as Dura Ace is Shimano's flagship gruppo, and ridded by professional cyclists who DO abuse their bikes for a living... it should be destroyed in testing.

It may not be as important to the average consumer... but the average consumer should not be buying Dura Ace for a trip with the kids on the bike path.
 

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I'd like to see a side-by-side comparison of Dura Ace and Red (09DA's inspiration). Red is available now, lighter and not more expensive. I suspect DA is lighter shifting, if you prefer that (Red-label Record is selling fast enough to prove it isn't preferred by everyone) and Red is still more ergonomic. I don't see anything in 09DA that makes it worth passing up Red for. I guess the crank might be stiffer... but, really, those parts are either given to you by a sponsor or you're not strong enough to notice any difference on crank stiffness.
 

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I can't get to competitive's site either. My guess is that they overloaded their servers with the video content. I got an email from them this morning about the review. I'm sure many others got the same and flooded their server with requests.
 

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First thing rember guys is that their CURRENT price will not be correct. CC always posts these pre-pricing for groups higher. This way when they are sure and ready to sell, they will not come in too low.

There is a tread about this over at weight weenies.

One person mentioned they have SEEN the wholesale pricing already and it's more than 7800, but NOT that much higher like CC is posting now.

Also proces will come down after January as 7800 did and eBay sites.

Look here for more correct pricing. yes, it's in Euros but if you convert it, you will get a more reasonable estimate.
 

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MarvinK said:
I'd like to see a side-by-side comparison of Dura Ace and Red (09DA's inspiration). Red is available now, lighter and not more expensive. I suspect DA is lighter shifting, if you prefer that (Red-label Record is selling fast enough to prove it isn't preferred by everyone) and Red is still more ergonomic. I don't see anything in 09DA that makes it worth passing up Red for. I guess the crank might be stiffer... but, really, those parts are either given to you by a sponsor or you're not strong enough to notice any difference on crank stiffness.
I gotta agree that with SRAM Red and Rival being so aggressively priced, Shimano may see more of the OEM market evaporate unless they manage to drive down their pricing a bit. (SRAM Force is the odd one out right now). Unless Shimano is ceding the mid-range market (105 and Ultegra) to Rival entirely...
 

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Dajianshan said:
But seeing as Dura Ace is Shimano's flagship gruppo, and ridded by professional cyclists who DO abuse their bikes for a living... it should be destroyed in testing.

It may not be as important to the average consumer... but the average consumer should not be buying Dura Ace for a trip with the kids on the bike path.
Truth be told, I think overweight American consumers can heap more abuse on bicycles and groups than pro racers. First, pro racers know what they are doing, so they don't do stupid stuff like shift at the wrong times or jam things when they're obviously not working. And secondly, they're a lot lighter. There's lots of 250 lb amateurs riding DA and on a good downhill, they're going to stress the brakes a lot more than some lightweight pro ever will.

I don't think pros really "abuse" stuff, they do ride hard and push the limits of the intended use of the components. Morons with money do a lot better job with abuse and unintended use.
 

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akatsuki said:
Maybe, but then again, we would all be riding 105 or something then....
Where do you get that? Those of us who ride higher than 105 don't do it because Ultegra and Dura Ace allow us to crosschain with impunity and shift under extreme load.

akatsuki said:
And it is better hearing about how Campy is rebuildable but Shimano has a better crank and brakes etc...
Note how neither of those helpful points of comparison have anything to do with extreme use testing. :rolleyes:
 
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