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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Stage 8 is the first big mountain top finish of the Giro. There is no more drafting or sprinting up a finishing hill. It is the stage where big moves are made and the GC takes shape.


So here's the stage:
<img src="https://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2006//giro06/graphics/profile8.jpg">
Results


Provisional
1 Ivan Basso (Ita) Team CSC 4.04.19
2 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre-Fondital 0.30
3 José E. Gutierrez Cataluna (Spa) Phonak Hearing Systems
4 Giampaolo Caruso (Ita) Liberty Seguros-Würth Team 0.45
5 Luca Mazzanti (Ita) Ceramica Panaria-Navigare 1.09
6 Leonardo Piepoli (Ita) Saunier Duval-Prodir 1.15
7 Gilberto Simoni (Ita) Saunier Duval-Prodir
8 Danilo Di Luca (Ita) Liquigas 1.32
9 José Rujano Guillen (Ven) Selle Italia-Serramenti Diquigiovanni 1.50
10 Julio Alberto Perez Cuapio (Mex) Ceramica Panaria-Navigare 1.52

General classification after stage 8

1 Ivan Basso (Ita) Team CSC 31.41.17
2 José E. Gutierrez Cataluna (Spa) Phonak Hearing Systems 1.34
3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre-Fondital 1.48
4 Paolo Savoldelli (Ita) Discovery Channel Pro Cycling Team 2.35
5 Serguei Gonchar (Ukr) T-Mobile Team 2.43
6 Danilo Di Luca (Ita) Liquigas 2.48
7 Gilberto Simoni (Ita) Saunier Duval-Prodir 3.20
8 Giampaolo Caruso (Ita) Liberty Seguros-Würth Team 3.23


9 Tom Danielson (USA) Discovery Channel Pro Cycling Team 3.33</pre>
Live report:
https://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2006//giro06/?id=live/giro068


So this post is a true spoiler. Very few of us have seen the coverage because of the OLN late coverage situation. But what happened is pretty self-explanatory. The heads of state have arrived. The pretenders have been annihilated and the contenders tried to limit their loses.

My questions:

- Who is Guti? José E. Gutierrez Cataluna (Spa) Phonak Hearing Systems ? He now seems like a real solid player. Who is he? What has he done? Can he go the distance. I do not recall a single person here or in the media predicting success for him.

- I'm a wee bit curios about Giampaolo Caruso (Ita) Liberty Seguros-Würth Team as well.

- Is Salvodelli cooked? Did Danielson wait for him? Could Danielson have done a lot better?

francois
 

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Gutierrez Cataluna is one of those riders who generally does well but rarely wins anything although he has two stage victories in the Dauphine and one in the Vuelta.

Salvodelli isn't cooked yet, but Basso is firing up the stove and looking for that recipe of Savoldelli all' Funghi Porcini. :D He will probably lose more time in the ITT on thursday so things are looking a bit bleak at the moment. Where the hell are Davitamon-Lotto when you need them? ;)
 

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José E. Gutierrez did get third place in the first stage time trial. So he can trial trial and climb. He sounds like a real contender if he can avoid burning out.
 

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francois said:
Did Danielson wait for him?
Nope. That would have been difficult, seeing as ol' TD was shelled when they hit the climb and the selection was made.

Maybe the question should be: did Paolo wait for Danielson? ;)

francois said:
Could Danielson have done a lot better?
Dunno. Also don't really know how much work he's done so far (missed yesterday's stage, and apparently he did some massive pulls in the TTT).
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
botto said:
Nope. That would have been difficult, seeing as ol' TD was shelled when they hit the climb and the selection was made.

Maybe the question should be: did Paolo wait for Danielson? ;)



Dunno. Also don't really know how much work he's done so far (missed yesterday's stage, and apparently he did some massive pulls in the TTT).
I'm not insinuating btw. Just an honest question as I haven't seen any tv coverage yet. Jus saw this:
16:43 CEST 169km/2km to go Tommy D is leading Savoldelli and Noè at 1'25.

francois
 

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Once they hit the final climb, and Sastre lit things up, Danielson missed the cut and Savoldelli was isolated.

You didn't see him until the cameras switched to him pacing Savoldelli.



francois said:
I'm not insinuating btw. Just an honest question as I haven't seen any tv coverage yet. Jus saw this:
16:43 CEST 169km/2km to go Tommy D is leading Savoldelli and Noè at 1'25.

francois
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I just can't believe how big the time gaps are in GC!

3 Damiano Cunego (Ita) Lampre-Fondital 1.48
4 Paolo Savoldelli (Ita) Discovery Channel Pro Cycling Team 2.35
5 Serguei Gonchar (Ukr) T-Mobile Team 2.43
6 Danilo Di Luca (Ita) Liquigas 2.48
7 Gilberto Simoni (Ita) Saunier Duval-Prodir 3.20

Now those are big gaps after only one mountain stage. Cunego is going to lose more time in the TT. Basso is just going to walk away with this unless something changes.

Now there's a lot of racing left. And it's too early to tell. And anything can happen, I know of course. Jeez, I hope something happens because the smart money says that Basso is going to add to the lead on every mountain top finish.

Cunego was my pick. I think he's still got good chance. He needs to find a weakness in Basso's armor.

francois
 

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I hope Basso isn't going to pull a Lance on this years Giro. TDF being decided on the first mountain top finish every year became very tiresome.
 

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jbrumm said:
I hope Basso isn't going to pull a Lance on this years Giro. TDF being decided on the first mountain top finish every year became very tiresome.
But this is the Giro, not the Tour! Wait 'till that ski slope in stage 17. Plus the Mortirolo... I still think a pure climber like Cunego or Rujano will be able to light it up on some of those. Although, to judge by what happened today it looks like Basso just has another gear; as the CN coverage said, Basso pulled away from Cunego "like he was on a scooter". And he's only likely to gain in the ITT. Maybe some of the other contenders could put a little E.coli in his pasta? If this goes on he could get sick, lose an hour, and still win the damn thing! Cunego didn't look bad, though he's gonna be hurt by the TT.
 

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Basso and CSC rode a pretty smart race. Let Saunier Duval do all of the hard chasing before the climb, which kept Sastre and Basso fresh. Then, with 7 km, Sastre lit it up and got rid of the support climbers for the GC guys while Basso sat in and waited for his chance. Sastre must have rode a pretty hard pace because Cuapio, Sella and Rujano got gapped, except Rujano managed to get back into the thick of things.
The only drawback is watching the coverage on RAI is tough because I don't understand a lick of Italian...but, if I watch enough of the RAI, by the end of the Giro, I might actually understand 'em!
 

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dlbcx said:
Basso and CSC rode a pretty smart race. Let Saunier Duval do all of the hard chasing before the climb, which kept Sastre and Basso fresh. Then, with 7 km, Sastre lit it up and got rid of the support climbers for the GC guys while Basso sat in and waited for his chance. Sastre must have rode a pretty hard pace because Cuapio, Sella and Rujano got gapped, except Rujano managed to get back into the thick of things.
The only drawback is watching the coverage on RAI is tough because I don't understand a lick of Italian...but, if I watch enough of the RAI, by the end of the Giro, I might actually understand 'em!
That was my point above. Total Postal/Lance style of stage racing. Basso can climb as well as most of the true climbers, and he can TT about as well as the best TT riders. Who's that remind you of? And, oh yeah, Basso has the strongest team.
 

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jbrumm said:
That was my point above. Total Postal/Lance style of stage racing. Basso can climb as well as most of the true climbers, and he can TT about as well as the best TT riders. Who's that remind you of? And, oh yeah, Basso has the strongest team.
I have to admit, even though I said many times that Basso is a fool for trying to attempt Giro and TdF double this year, I now think he might have a chance at pulling it off.

I still think he is a full, he should pick one (I would pick TdF) and stick with it.

But today's time gaps speak volumes about his preparation and his talent. I thought Cunego (and even Savoldelli) will give him more of a competition.

He is a bit like Armstrong, I guess. I know people don't like utter domination, but I think it's absolutely amazing if he can only increase his lead over the rivals from now on. Awesomeness=amazing. If you want close races, go to equally mediocre (in terms of preparation or talent) riders.
 

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Brutal stage. Flat as a board, then wham! Basso looked strongest, but remember last year...Danielson did work for Salvodelli, then dropped off the pace, then when Salvo conked, helped him up the hill. He looked pretty fresh. Simoni looked stronger than he was. Di Luca and Rujano are not going to sneak up on anyone this year, that's for certain.

For a second I thought Disco was going to give TD the go-ahead to drop Salvo and move up on GC. I think he could have gained 30 seconds to a minute. But that's just my impression.

For the poster who described Basso as not one of the "strongest climbers," I'd argue that he IS the strongest climber. He dropped DiLuca/Rujano/Cunego etc. without much difficulty today.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
peter1 said:
Brutal stage. Flat as a board, then wham! Basso looked strongest, but remember last year...Danielson did work for Salvodelli, then dropped off the pace, then when Salvo conked, helped him up the hill. He looked pretty fresh. Simoni looked stronger than he was. Di Luca and Rujano are not going to sneak up on anyone this year, that's for certain.

For a second I thought Disco was going to give TD the go-ahead to drop Salvo and move up on GC. I think he could have gained 30 seconds to a minute. But that's just my impression.

For the poster who described Basso as not one of the "strongest climbers," I'd argue that he IS the strongest climber. He dropped DiLuca/Rujano/Cunego etc. without much difficulty today.

Absolutely agreed. The stage was soo harsh. Everyone looked pale at the finish, including Basso. He really put the hurt on himself and everyone else. It's nice to see him let it all hang out and not ride so conservatively.

Nobody picked him as the strongest climber but today's results speak volumes. It is his kind of climb though. Not too steep, just high speed, power. When the climbs get steeper and more varied, the others might have a chance.

In this off-season, I heard that Basso climbed for 6 hours at a time on his TT bike. This was done by the great Riis to strengthen his back and TT legs, I believe. Seeing his performance today, it really looked like the difference. He just left Cunego 'like a motor scooter' as someone said.

Yes it looks like Danielson could have gained time. Salvodelli cracked and Danielson (who was dropped earlier) nursed him up the hill.

francois
 

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jbrumm said:
That was my point above. Total Postal/Lance style of stage racing. Basso can climb as well as most of the true climbers, and he can TT about as well as the best TT riders. Who's that remind you of? And, oh yeah, Basso has the strongest team.
The same solution applies to Basso as it did to Lance (in all of the tours but one). Make Basso tow big fat Ullrich up the climbs in a kiddie trailer full of ice-cream, beer and Kraftwerk CDs.

That'll level everything out for those weaker riders, you know, the peleton.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Rujano was pretty interesting.

Yesterday, he got sick and was reportedly throwing up on the side of the road.

Today, he got dropped and clawed his way back to the front. As soon as he got there, he immediately goes on the attack. That is awesome!! After that all hell broke loose as Cunego went off the front then Basso countered.

Simoni was setting up all climb for his signature attack. It got diffused unfortunately by these other aggressors.

francois
 

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It's worth keeping in mind that this is an isolated mountain stage with just one climb, so everyone could pretty much bury themselves on the final climb knowing that it'll be (relatively) easy riding until thursday. Things could go differently later when you have several hard stages in a row, plus multiple hard climbs in a single stage.

Really, I'm just trying to imagine how Basso could NOT walk away with this thing...
 

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francois said:
Rujano was pretty interesting.

Yesterday, he got sick and was reportedly throwing up on the side of the road.

Today, he got dropped and clawed his way back to the front. As soon as he got there, he immediately goes on the attack. That is awesome!! After that all hell broke loose as Cunego went off the front then Basso countered.

Simoni was setting up all climb for his signature attack. It got diffused unfortunately by these other aggressors.

francois
Yeah, then Rujano got dropped but good. If he rode more sensibly after the catch he would have finished several groups higher. The pointless attack that wasted vital energy and got him all of 15-30 meters- brilliant! Given his off-season antics detailed in Procycling, the comment of thousand dollar legs, nickel brain comes to mind.

Simoni and Deluca made their teams ride at the front for like 100k, then both get dropped when it counts. THAT'S going to be an uncomfortable breakfast table. Looks like Deluca should have stuck with his prior year's preparation. I think he has Brad McGee syndrome (rides the Giro well once as a surprise, changes everything- then does much worse. Oops.)

Cunego on the other hand, rode smart and burned his matches when it mattered (the anti-Rujano). He could not hang with Basso today, but he kept it close. He likely will be a factor in the last week. If Basso slips, kid rocket could pounce.

Paolo looked a bit slow today whenever it was steep-- so much for the "he's cruising" nonsense. I expect him to get stronger as the Giro progresses and score some time in the TT's, but he may be battling for the third podium spot at best at this point. If this continues, Tommy D will have to be given some rope during the last week.

Basso looks very strong, but did last year too. Given the severe nature of the last week, how hot he came into the Giro and most of the early season, the possible downside is either fading in the last week, or another bad day like last year. Otherwise it's his race to lose right now.

Fun stage though.

:)
 

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Why do people say it's so impossible to win Giro/TdF now? As I recall, the year before Mr Singlemind starting winning ever TdF, Pantani pulled the double (yea yea...year of epo).

It's not like it hasn't been done before.
 

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Coolhand said:
Yeah, then Rujano got dropped but good. If he rode more sensibly after the catch he would have finished several groups higher. The pointless attack that wasted vital energy and got him all of 15-30 meters- brilliant! Given his off-season antics detailed in Procycling, the comment of thousand dollar legs, nickel brain comes to mind.

Simoni and Deluca made their teams ride at the front for like 100k, then both get dropped when it counts. THAT'S going to be an uncomfortable breakfast table. Looks like Deluca should have stuck with his prior year's preparation. I think he has Brad McGee syndrome (rides the Giro well once as a surprise, changes everything- then does much worse. Oops.)

Cunego on the other hand, rode smart and burned his matches when it mattered (the anti-Rujano). He could not hang with Basso today, but he kept it close. He likely will be a factor in the last week. If Basso slips, kid rocket could pounce.


Paolo looked a bit slow today whenever it was steep-- so much for the "he's cruising" nonsense. I expect him to get stronger as the Giro progresses and score some time in the TT's, but he may be battling for the third podium spot at best at this point. If this continues, Tommy D will have to be given some rope during the last week.

Basso looks very strong, but did last year too. Given the severe nature of the last week, how hot he came into the Giro and most of the early season, the possible downside is either fading in the last week, or another bad day like last year. Otherwise it's his race to lose right now.

Fun stage though.

:)
It is pretty much Basso's race to lose. If his form holds up, he should be hold onto the jersey until Milan. But, there is a long ways to go before this Giro is in the can!
 
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