Touring on a Race Bike?

casioqv · Oct 21, 2008

I want to try bicycle touring for the first time, but I don't have a proper touring bike- just an aluminum Cannondale CAAD3 race bike. I read all over the internet that one shouldn't tour with a race bike, but I don't understand why it wouldn't work well, at least to just get started.

I would like to start out doing an overnight camping trip in warm dry weather (I live in the southern California desert) where I ride 50-100 miles, camp, and then ride home the next day. I am already into light weight backpacking, and can be fully self sufficient for several days with about 30lbs of gear.

My Cannondale is rated for a 275lb rider + 10lbs of gear = 285lbs. I weigh 220lbs, and with 30lbs of gear, I'd still be at 250lbs, 25 less than the rated capacity of the bike. The frame also actually does have rear eyelets for mounting a rack. How could weighing 65 lbs more be ok for my bike, but 30 lbs gear be too much? I've met plenty of guys pushing 300lbs riding Aluminum Cannondales like mine, and I've never heard of any frame cracking or other issues from them, as long as their bikes are CAAD3 or newer.

My question is this- is there a good reason why I shouldn't install slightly wider tires (700/25c or 28c), a lower geared cassette (13-30 rear, triple front), a rear rack, and some rear panniers and try doing some short weekend touring on my race bike instead of dumping $1500 on a touring bike?

I plan to eventually collect parts and build my own steel frame touring bike, but I'd like to get started sooner.

MB1 · Oct 21, 2008

Might be even cheaper just to get a BOB trailer.

BTW folks have toured on just about every kind of bike and even unicycles.

Touring is about the activity not the equipment.

Do it, you are sure to have a good time.

theBreeze · Oct 21, 2008

Got for it.

casioqv said:
My question is this- is there a good reason why I shouldn't install slightly wider tires (700/25c or 28c), a lower geared cassette (13-30 rear, triple front), a rear rack, and some rear panniers and try doing some short weekend touring on my race bike instead of dumping $1500 on a touring bike?

Not at all!

"Touring bikes" tend toward more relaxed geometries for comfort and heavier frames for heavier loads. This only becomes and issue when you start talking long days and/or long miles between "support." I think you could comfortably tour on a standard racing frame, given your adjustments, easily for a week or two depending on how many miles you want to cover each day. Since you are experienced with light weight backpacking doing similar on bike should be a peice of cake.

Another adjustment you might think about is raising the stem/handle bars if you can. You will find out if you need to on your shakedown cruise.

casioqv · Oct 21, 2008

MB1 said:
Might be even cheaper just to get a BOB trailer.

I looked into a bob trailer, but apparently it stresses the frame just as much as a rear rack, because the trailer is balanced by the bicycle.

I think a two-wheel trailer would be good, but I can't seem to find one designed for touring, rather than carrying children. Perhaps I could try to modify a childrens trailer, or make a new trailer myself.

MB1 said:
BTW folks have toured on just about every kind of bike and even unicycles.

Touring is about the activity not the equipment.

Do it, you are sure to have a good time.

Thanks for the advice, I like your attitude!

Most of the sites I've read seem to suggest that it's better not to tour at all then to do it without a super expensive purpose built touring bicycle.

ckilner · Oct 21, 2008

+1 on the trailer.

The Canondale probably won't have very good heel clearance for panniers and the short wheelbase will exaggerate the rear-weighted load. If you use a trailer, put on new brake pads.

casioqv · Oct 21, 2008

ckilner said:
+1 on the trailer.

The Cannondale probably won't have very good heel clearance for panniers and the short wheelbase will exaggerate the rear-weighted load. If you use a trailer, put on new brake pads.

So a short wheelbase makes it harder to balance a loaded bicycle? Is this because of the amount of weight, or the location of the weight (ie can the problem be mitigated by positioning the load properly)? It is more difficult for heavier riders to control a short wheel base bicycle?

I did find the "Axiom Streamliner Road Rack" which sits rearward to give enough heal clearance on bikes with short chain-stays, but I guess that wouldn't address the issue of a short wheel base making the bike unstable.

I'm using black Kool Stop pads, and new Ultegra calipers, which easily pass the "rear wheel lift" test on level dry ground- I don't know if they would still pass with a rear trailer or panniers.

kg1 · Oct 21, 2008

Will work great

This summer, I did almost exactly what you are planning to do. I took my Gunnar Roadie (a steel racing-type frame, but with rear rack eyelets), mounted a rack and some panniers, put on a larger cassette and went touring. I didn’t change my tires from the 23s I had on. If you’ve got some nice roads to ride, it’s a wonderful way to travel. You might want to check to make sure your bike can take larger tiers before you spend the money. I’m not sure mine would.

The guy I toured with bought a Trek 520 for the trip. The Trek seemed more stable than my bike, particularly during out of the saddle climbs, and his bike was set up with the bars about level with the saddle where I have a 2 or 3 inch drop, so I think he may have been a little more comfortable in the last few hours of the day.. In addition, the Trek had fenders, something that I am sure would be very helpful in the rain.

Still, I didn’t have any trouble with my set-up. In fact, everything worked flawlessly, and I hope to do a lot more of this type of riding (without buying another bike).

These guys were very helpful to me in getting things set up: http://www.arkel-od.com/

Something that would have saved me an hour or so is this: the rack mounts are threaded (at least mine were), but the frame paint made getting the bolts to thread difficult.

Good luck and have fun.

kg1

MB1 · Oct 21, 2008

casioqv said:
I looked into a bob trailer, but apparently it stresses the frame just as much as a rear rack, because the trailer is balanced by the bicycle.

A BOB trailer solves all the heal clearance/pannier problems, doesn't change the balance of your bike and comes right off the bike if you want to do some riding out of the campsite/motel. It holds a lot of stuff too so if you really load it you will need lower gears in the hills.

Burley makes a 2 wheel "Flatbed" cargo trailer but IMO is isn't as practical as a single wheel trailer for travel, still it is a very good unit.

Frame stress from a trailer? I don't know about that and I sure wouldn't worry about it except for a carbon frame with bonded lugs.

Click to expand...

casioqv · Oct 21, 2008

I found a really good web site with cheap and lightweight packing lists: http://www.ultralightbackpacker.com/

He has a list for 2-5 day trips in weather 20F or warmer, with 10lbs total pack weight before food and water. A lot of the stuff he brings wouldn't be needed for bicycle touring like a water purifier, or tent (I just use a tarp and twine to build a tent on the spot) so I think I could stay around 10lbs and also include some basic tools (crank bros multi-tool, folding tire, tube, patch kit, etc) and still be around 10lbs, then include 3 liters of water (6.6lbs) and 2 days worth of dried food (about 6000 calories, 4lbs) for a total of under 22lbs of gear (rack weighs 1lb, panniers the same as his backpack). The bike itself weighs another 19lbs....

I'd probably bring the weight up to 30lbs with a camera, extra liter or two of water, a water purifier, a gps, and a few other things I don't really need.

My Own Private Idaho · Oct 21, 2008

+1 on the BOB trailer. It doesn't stress the frame that bad.

Burely makes a two-wheeled cargo trailer, but I like the BOB's attachment system better.

Rider5200 · Oct 21, 2008

If you use your CAAD3, you are passing up the opportunity to buy a new bike!

seeborough · Oct 21, 2008

Your current set up will do fine

casioqv said:
I want to try bicycle touring for the first time, but I don't have a proper touring bike- just an aluminum Cannondale CAAD3 race bike. I read all over the internet that one shouldn't tour with a race bike, but I don't understand why it wouldn't work well, at least to just get started.

I would like to start out doing an overnight camping trip in warm dry weather (I live in the southern California desert) where I ride 50-100 miles, camp, and then ride home the next day. I am already into light weight backpacking, and can be fully self sufficient for several days with about 30lbs of gear.

My Cannondale is rated for a 275lb rider + 10lbs of gear = 285lbs. I weigh 220lbs, and with 30lbs of gear, I'd still be at 250lbs, 25 less than the rated capacity of the bike. The frame also actually does have rear eyelets for mounting a rack. How could weighing 65 lbs more be ok for my bike, but 30 lbs gear be too much? I've met plenty of guys pushing 300lbs riding Aluminum Cannondales like mine, and I've never heard of any frame cracking or other issues from them, as long as their bikes are CAAD3 or newer.

My question is this- is there a good reason why I shouldn't install slightly wider tires (700/25c or 28c), a lower geared cassette (13-30 rear, triple front), a rear rack, and some rear panniers and try doing some short weekend touring on my race bike instead of dumping $1500 on a touring bike?

I plan to eventually collect parts and build my own steel frame touring bike, but I'd like to get started sooner.

I have owned a Caad3 for 10 years and have used it with a rack and 25mm tires for commuting. As you know, it's basically indestructible, fairly light, albeit a little harsh by today's standards. Nevertheless, I rode it 480 miles on the Blue Ridge Parkway and the bike performed well loaded - fairly comfortable an no handling issues going downhill at 55mph.
I have used a clip-on fender at times, but the frame might have have enough clearance for a full set. Trial end error, I suppose. I'd agree with the fellows above: Go for it! :thumbsup:

robwh9 · Oct 21, 2008

2 or 3 day tours I'll do on my "race" bike with 23 mm tires and a seatpost rack rather than on my Trek 520 touring bike. It's just much more fun to ride.

See my reply to http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=150846 for example.

anthony.delorenzo · Oct 21, 2008

I say jump in with what you have. Heck, wear your backpack if you need to, the point is to get out there and do it. If you get serious, maybe invest in more gear.

My wife toured on her racing bike this spring, running 23 mm tires without braze-ons for a rack. We attached a rack to her bike using a large u-bolt and a couple of P-clamps with rubber shims underneath. Worked just fine for 160 - 240 km days.

You may find that you can get away with a large handlebar and saddle bag combination, although that could be a stretch with full camping gear. Look at something like the Carradice Super C with 23 L of capacity.

majura · Oct 22, 2008

Just adding onto to all the great info already here.

If you're C'dale is set up in a typical 'road' position with negative rise on the stem, maybe try flipping the stem up (or if you have a shorter one around, putting it on with + rise) to give you a more relaxed casual position.

casioqv · Oct 22, 2008

seeborough said:
I have owned a Caad3 for 10 years and have used it with a rack and 25mm tires for commuting. As you know, it's basically indestructible, fairly light, albeit a little harsh by today's standards. Nevertheless, I rode it 480 miles on the Blue Ridge Parkway and the bike performed well loaded - fairly comfortable an no handling issues going downhill at 55mph.
I have used a clip-on fender at times, but the frame might have have enough clearance for a full set. Trial end error, I suppose. I'd agree with the fellows above: Go for it! :thumbsup:

It's great to hear that someone else has done serious commuting and touring with a CAAD3, and had good results.

I keep hearing that the CAAD3 is harsh, but it has never felt that way to me. Perhaps this is because I weigh over 200lbs, but I am also inclined to believe Sheldon Brown, when he said that the tires, saddle, and bike fit all affect the ride to a greater degree than the fame design or material. I've also heard people say that they crack easily, or only last a few years but I've yet to find any solid evidence that one has actually cracked- ever (not to say that it hasn't happened). Of course, most people are not "misusing" it as I plan to do.

Do you think the CAAD3 has clearance for a 28mm tire in the rear? I realize this would require the wheel to remain very well adjusted, but I think the wider tires would also help protect the wheel from going out of adjustment. I am also considering getting a set of race-blades clip on fenders, but it rains so infrequently here (well under 10 inches/year) it's pretty easy to only plan trips with almost 0% chance of rain. Maybe the fenders would help keep dust and sand from kicking up into the chain.

I'm excited about the idea of touring with a setup where the combined weight of my bike and gear is less than that of many unloaded touring bikes!

casioqv · Oct 22, 2008

majura said:
If you're C'dale is set up in a typical 'road' position with negative rise on the stem, maybe try flipping the stem up (or if you have a shorter one around, putting it on with + rise) to give you a more relaxed casual position.

What would you consider to be the best relative height between the seat and bars for long touring rides? Should the seat be higher, lower, or level?

I already put the handlebars about level with the seat, since I was having neck pain on long rides from trying to look far ahead on the road with low bars.

Interestingly, Cannondale uses a 90 degree stem (which gives a positive rise, due to the headtube angle). I guess that's somewhat unusual for a race bike since it makes it difficult to get the bars lower than the seat if the seat is already in a low position.

majura · Oct 22, 2008

casioqv I've also heard people say that they crack easily said:
Ever heard of Crack-n-fail? There was a short period of C'dales that had some issues a long time ago. Hence, why they now offer a pretty solid 'lifetime warranty' for the original owner. Nowadays it's not a problem except for the occasional frame, but all manufactures have that.

casioqv · Oct 22, 2008

majura said:
Ever heard of Crack-n-fail? There was a short period of C'dales that had some issues a long time ago. Hence, why they now offer a pretty solid 'lifetime warranty' for the original owner. Nowadays it's not a problem except for the occasional frame, but all manufactures have that.

Yea, I've heard of the older frames cracking, but I haven't heard of any CAAD3 or newer frames cracking, since they changed the design to use larger and thinner tubes.

I doubt they would honor the warranty if the frame was used with a rack/panniers, since the manual says specifically not to do so (even though the fame has mount points for them, go figure).

My Own Private Idaho · Oct 22, 2008

I don't own a Cannondale, so this is FWIW, but I doubt you will be able to ride with 28mm tires. 25mm should fit fine though. The only way to know for sure it to try it.

Touring on a Race Bike?

casioqv

MB1

theBreeze

casioqv

ckilner

casioqv

kg1

MB1

casioqv

My Own Private Idaho

Rider5200

seeborough

robwh9

anthony.delorenzo

majura

casioqv

casioqv

majura

casioqv

My Own Private Idaho

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