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Shorter stem on a road bike

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ejewels

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Hey Guys,

I got a professional fit for 2.5 hours yesterday at my LBS. The guy used Trek precision fit along with a mix of serotta and other fitting techniques/theories. I am coming off a neck injury, so it was important for me to be a little more upright and comfortable getting back into the game.

After all was said and done, I most closely matched with a 56 Domane but with a 80mm stem. It was Trek's closest match mathematically as well as my fitter. If I went 54 it had me on a 90mm stem, however the 56 required less fit modification overall and gave me more options to tweak for fitting purposes and future growth, like getting more fit and wanting to get lower/more aero.

My question is, how many of you run a shorter stem on your road bike? I've always used 100+ stems but was never professionally fitted until yesterday.
 
#2 ·
I'm going to guess they have a 56 in stock they want to get rid of and not a 54.

It's somewhere counter intuitive but actually the 54 is the one that allows for a more aggressive position in the future because the headtube is 1.5 cm shorter. And the reach is only .3 cm shorter so pretty much insignificant.

An 80 stem is too short and it's simply wrong that that the 56 will allow you to get more aggressive in the future as compared to the 54.
 
#3 ·
I hope you didn't pay them money for that "fit". That shop owes you 2.5 hours of your life. An 8 cm stem is incredibly short and is going to result in twitchy handling. And how does going down to a 54 cm only increase the stem length by one cm? Have you considered the angle of the stem? That would be a way to get you more upright, yet easily changed to more aggressive (flipping it, or going with a stem with less angle) fit later on. Or what about those upright type "comfort bikes" like a Specialized Roubaix? Just suggestions -- and I've never owned a Trek os Specialized bike, so I'm no expert on either.

You really ought to check out another bike shop.
 
#4 ·
The goal I shoot for is a frame fit using a 110mm stem (I think that was Eddy Merckx's standard too so who am I to question that) and the shortest I have is a 100. As others have commented, sounds like the Shop is trying to "fit" you to what they have in stock and not what you really need.

If you can only go to a 90mm on a 54, you may actually need a smaller frame than a 54.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
So let me get this straight. I should go and tell this professional fitter, who has been doing this for 25 years and holds many certs and is highly regarded in the state as one of the best, that he's wrong? And that people on the internet are telling me what fits without knowing my proportions?

Let me clarify a few things. He had both sizes in the shop and is a big Trek and Giant dealer with lots of stock and options. Its a brand new '17, so not old stock. Even if you go by the trek size chart (which you shouldn't really) I'm a 56.

Also, what he said was that the 56 allowed more fitting options and required less modification than the 54 would have. The 54 would have worked, but I'd need to max out the risers and the saddle to bar drop was too great as I have long legs. So not only would i need a new stem still, it wouldn't help with my neck issues as the stack would be too low.

Just looking to see peoples experiences with an 80 mm stem. So far its "too short" but I've been reading around and it seems the "too twitchy" thing is a myth. And many seem to run them.
 
#6 ·
Stem length and how it affects handling depends on things like head tube angle and fork rake and all sorts of things I don't understand. I haven't really tried. I have a few lengths of the same stem, so when I build up a new frame I take a rough guess and then adjust from there. I'm usually pretty close.

I've seen some pretty short stems on H2 Treks (down to 70mm on a 56cm frame), at least shorter than I would run. I usually run a 100mm on 56cm H1 Madone (haven't built up a H2 yet), and most 56cm frames are similar for me. If I go down to a 55cm or 54cm frame, I go up to a 110mm stem (depending on the fit goals). That's me, and your fit goals are completely different.

What I would do is see if they have a 54cm and 56cm in stock and test ride both with their suggested stem lengths. If not the same bike, one with a similar geometry. See what works for you. Without seeing you on the bike, that's about the best advice I can give you.
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
I think I probably should have stated that I'm not going for a race fit, smaller bike, etc. I WANT a larger, stable endurance fit for my neck issues. The stem length was basically due to me constantly saying "this feels better" when we were on the reach part of the fit. He even expected me to be on a longer stem. I think going on the shorter stem was more likely a result of my flexibility and comfort now, which I hope will change.
 
#9 ·
ejewels said:
So let me get this straight. I should go and tell this professional fitter, who has been doing this for 25 years and holds many certs and is highly regarded in the state as one of the best, that he's wrong? And that people on the internet are telling me what fits without knowing my proportions?
Click to expand...
You can do whatever you want with the information you get here. If all you want is confirmation though you need to understand people might give honest answers and not just say what you want to hear. You'll have to decide for yourself is you want to listen or not.
 
#11 ·
I have bikes with stems of 120 mm and 80 mm, chosen to adjust for different top tube lengths. The difference in handling from the stem length difference is subtle, small, and easy to adjust to almost instantly. It has far less effect than the real steering geometry parameters (head angle, rake, trail, etc.) There is zero "twitchiness" associated with the shorter stem, IME. I think people are overstating the "problem," based on my own experience.
 
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#13 ·
ejewels said:
So let me get this straight. I should go and tell this professional fitter, who has been doing this for 25 years and holds many certs and is highly regarded in the state as one of the best, that he's wrong? And that people on the internet are telling me what fits without knowing my proportions?.
Click to expand...
OK, so let me get this straight -- you have the best professional fitter in the entire state (hopefully a really big state like California), who has been doing this for a billion years, and you question his advice by posting the results to a bunch of dumbasses on the internet?

If you keep saying 'that feels better' every time he shortens the stem, then guess what -- you'll end up with a short stem. Some free advice -- have you considered a 58 cm frame with a 7 cm stem? At any rate, keep us posted if you find anyone who actually has a bike with an 8 cm stem.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
Jay Strongbow said:
You can do whatever you want with the information you get here. If all you want is confirmation though you need to understand people might give honest answers and not just say what you want to hear. You'll have to decide for yourself is you want to listen or not.
Click to expand...
Honest answers by who though, thats the question. Pro bike fitters? You're right, I don't want to hear assumption-fueled answers by people that don't know my proportions or body dynamics. Is that wrong? I also don't mean to sound confrontational. I just really want to see people's views on running a shorter stem.
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
pmf said:
OK, so let me get this straight -- you have the best professional fitter in the entire state (hopefully a really big state like California), who has been doing this for a billion years, and you question his advice by posting the results to a bunch of dumbasses on the internet?

If you keep saying 'that feels better' every time he shortens the stem, then guess what -- you'll end up with a short stem. Some free advice -- have you considered a 58 cm frame with a 7 cm stem? At any rate, keep us posted if you find anyone who actually has a bike with an 8 cm stem.
Click to expand...
Looks like 2 posters already said they use a 80. What are your credentials to be telling me for sure an 80 is too short and my bike is way too big without knowing my body dynamics, flexibility, proportions or merely anything about my experience?

I'm not trying to argue with you and I appreciate any feedback. However being told I may need a 52, that no one runs a 80mm stem and that I got "had" by a reputable shop seems a bit much no? Especially without me ever posting my stats?
 
#18 ·
Here's the deal, you currently have a "Fred" setup, and that's what people are griping about.

You currently have a very high and short stem to deal with whatever issues you have, and it's not the way things are done. The setup you have is not correct, it's not normal, it's not as the manufacturers intended, and people are letting you know that. Would you put a 6" steering wheel on your car? Your setup is wrong/not ideal/Fred because of your injury or medical condition or whatever it is.

So they're right. An 80mm stem on a 56cm frame is wrong, it doesn't belong there, the company never designed that bike that way, and all those spacers shouldn't be under the stem either. But alas, you're not normal, you're injured or recovering or whatever is going on.

So for now ignore people here, as you aren't normal. Once you get riding and get putting some miles in, you'll feel it quickly. You will want your stem lower, you will want it longer, it will cause you problems as is.

You may think that bunching up your spine is the best thing to do for comfort, but you're wrong, it's the other way around.

And you can't expect the fitter to do what's right for you when you're in there complaining about pain or injuries or whatever in your neck. He'll try to get you comfortable on your bike, and then FOR FREE, he will adjust your position later/over time as you become more flexible and as your current incorrect position starts to hurt.
 
#19 ·
JCavilia said:
I have bikes with stems of 120 mm and 80 mm, chosen to adjust for different top tube lengths. The difference in handling from the stem length difference is subtle, small, and easy to adjust to almost instantly. It has far less effect than the real steering geometry parameters (head angle, rake, trail, etc.) There is zero "twitchiness" associated with the shorter stem, IME. I think people are overstating the "problem," based on my own experience.
Click to expand...
This. An 8 cm stem on a 56 is ​unproblematic.
Also: Nobody mentions bar reach in these discussions. Ever. Until I do.
 
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#20 ·
All my bikes have 140mm, or 135mm stems. I tried a 130 on one, but had to change it to a 140, to be more comfortable.
 
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